| Search | Login/Register
   Home » Audio Discussions » Purist Audio Design vs. Purist Audio Design (25 posts, 2 pages)
  Print Thread | 1st Post |  
Page 1 of 2 (25 items) Select Pages:  1 2 »
   Target    Threads for related reading   Most recent post in related threads   Forum  Replies   Views   Started 
  »  New  The “Wet and Fuzzy” cable...  The “Wet and Fuzzy” cable....  Audio Discussions  Forum     0  10773  05-09-2008
  »  New  Cable Current Loading..  The Purist’s Problems...  Audio Discussions  Forum     5  24860  05-14-2008
  »  New  Chasing utopian better phono interconnect...  Did I miss something?...  Analog Playback Forum     6  77113  06-05-2008
  »  New  We who are about to die... (a cable thread)..  Double-twisting 2 1/2; a tail of synergy...  Audio Discussions  Forum     31  144593  06-28-2008
  »  New  FM and … cables…..  Nordost and the schmalts...  Off Air Audio Forum     2  23254  04-15-2009
  »  New  DSET and Cables...  DSET and Cables....  Audio Discussions  Forum     0  10548  02-23-2010
04-06-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,534
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 1
Post ID: 7131
Reply to: 7131
Purist Audio Design vs. Purist Audio Design

It looks like Purist introduced a new line of cables: Proteus Provectus.  Dave Clark from “Positive Feedback” made a write up about those new cables. Hmmm… I do not like what I have read, particularly reading some things between the lines:

http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue36/pad_proteus.htm

I do not know Dave Clark but I do not like what he wrote, some of his comments are juts purely idiotic – what do you want from him – he needs to fulfill the duty of any audio reviewer and he uses all available for him stupidity to convince the readers “to buy”. To make people to buy - is it why any audio reviewer has any “audio thinking” to begin with? Some Dave Clark’s comments are crear foolish pearls of audio reviewing, in fact those pearls have became the Positive Feedback’s trademarks....

I am not a big admirer of the sonic direction where Purist Audio Design went after 2000-2001. The POD went for instantaneous, easy and superficially thrilling, cheap Sound (a good much for the new Lamm production) – no wonder that this “new” sound is readily embraced by the today’s audio industry and  consequentially was propelled to the admiration of the ordinary audio suckers-simpletons.

I should not be too hard on Dave Clark. He is in a way a hostage in the game that he does not understands, he just was used. Any magazine editor and smart manufacture knows how to match the misery of an audio product with ignorance, simplicity or stupidity of an audio reviewer. Anyhow, I never heard the Proteus Provectus but at this point this cable has bad signs.

First, why Dave Clark, the person who apparently has no experience with Purist Audio Design products was given to review the POD’s new cables? Does POD willing to send a message that the new cable is a complete disassociation from POD original Proteus and Dominus legacy? If so then it is very sad. In 90s the Dominus, Proteus (Rev A and Rev B, I less like Rev C) and even in some cases the inexpensive Colossus cables were so far more interesting than any other cable produced that it was laughable. The further POD products were “differed” in terms of Sound. Any person who knows the real value of the POD cable and how to use them (very important) learning about the new Proteus Provectus cable would ask: is it the same Proteus that was 10 years ago? Design-wise it is obviously different but how about Sound? What the hell Dave Clark, who just was given his first POD cable, can say? Why the review was not given to a long-time Proteus-level user?

Second. Dave Clark says that he got involved into all of it being solicited by Albert Porter. Let me teach you something.  Albert Porter is a person who has no other titles then “fuckin’ whore”. I witnessed many events where he used lies, deceptions and fraud to promote and to create idiotic excitement around various products that he was pushing at that time.  Albert is long time POD user, he is a photographer who makes POD pictures, has personal relation with POD and he is one of the army of cheerleaders that POD deploys when they need to trumpet  and to drum up the new products. I know quite a few of those people and generally they are fine. The Albert Porter however, takes his “responsibility” to extremes instead of “opinions” he spread the streams of sleazy deceit. I have seen it again and again and the only fact the Albert Porter is heavily promoting the Proteus Provectus cable make me to suspect that the cable might be garbage. I hope the Porte -motherfucker just hangs himself on those cables – it will be just a perfect waste a cable… From a different perspective what makes him different from any other Audiogon-level “dealers”?

Anyhow, If someone who are familiar with older Proteus A, B cables have a chance to listen the new Proteus Provectus then please post you opinion.

Rgs, Romy


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
04-07-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,534
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 2
Post ID: 7139
Reply to: 7131
BTW, talking about the better cables.

I need to note that the methods that Purist uses are superbly powerful. A few years ago, inspired by what POD does I did number experiments damping cables with liquid. It is astonishing how sound was affected with different liquids. I was running at that time a direct wire from my MC cartridge to my step up transformer and I submerged the wires in a container with different liquids. I discover for instance that Scotch whisky very superbly affective. I experimented with different brand…. It was an interning time. I told my stories at that time to POD’s Jim Aud and he told me as well that they experimented with some crazy cables liquids …

The very best sound of anything I was able to get by submerging the naked, no isolation wires into liquid silicon insulator. During those few days while the silicon was still in the liquid state the sound/harmonics from that cable were nothing short of extraordinary.

Romy the caT


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
04-14-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
glaesemann
New York
Posts 22
Joined on 12-18-2007

Post #: 3
Post ID: 7196
Reply to: 7131
Purist Audio Design proper use and cable loading.
Roman,

You wrote:

[Any person who knows the real value of the POD cable and how to use them (very important)... ]

I'm interested in reading more about your findings on proper use of PAD cables. Is there a relation to your findings on "cable loading", of which I have also been interested in reading more.

Tim


"I'd rather know than believe." - Carl Sagan
04-14-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,534
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 4
Post ID: 7198
Reply to: 7196
The POD cables
Tim,

the cable loading is not what I meant. Purist does like higher current across the cable but which cable does not love it? Dave Clark described very well some of the aspect of usability of POD cables (like disturbance). Some of them he left out. For instance POD cables could not be broken-in probably by voltage higher the signal then they care. It means if one willing to use Dominus for MC phono needle then the person need to run .2mV for around 1000 hours across the cable. But again, the cables that Dave Clark described are new cable, the new conductors and perhaps they file with a new brand of antifreeze of brake fluid and they might have different usability demands.

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
04-14-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
glaesemann
New York
Posts 22
Joined on 12-18-2007

Post #: 5
Post ID: 7200
Reply to: 7198
Cable cooking = screwed up Dominus?
Hmmm, this is interesting. Is it your opinion then that if someone but Dominus on a cable cooker it could be ruined? This would affect trying 1990's Rev. A & B in my system because they can only come from used market and it would be unknown how they were broke-in and used during their life.

Tim


"I'd rather know than believe." - Carl Sagan
04-14-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,534
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 6
Post ID: 7202
Reply to: 7200
The freakish Dominus
I found that cable cookers do not work on Dominus. You have no idea why. Nothing got “ruined” but Dominus juts do not react to cable cookers. It sounds ridicules but it is what it is. Dominus should be burned in ONLY being plunge between the actual components where it will be used and by the actual signal that will be transmitting. If you driver via Dominus .2mV and will break it in with 200mV then you can drive 1000000 hours 200mV but it will no effect to the break-in status for .2mV. Dominus also is freakishly sensitive to load characteristics. If you just use an equivalent resistor then Dominus will not be burn-in properly. This cable should be burns in ONLY where it will be used. Do not ask me explanations why- I do not know…

The caT


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
04-14-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
glaesemann
New York
Posts 22
Joined on 12-18-2007

Post #: 7
Post ID: 7203
Reply to: 7202
This could be a first...
Time will tell, but unlike Seiki, BiDat, TU-X1, S2, etc. this may be the first time The Cat's comments drive DOWN the price of a piece of audio gear. ;-)

An interesting experiment would be if you sent Dominus home to Jim for a full fluid transfusion, would it re-break in properly in different location in system?


"I'd rather know than believe." - Carl Sagan
04-14-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,534
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 8
Post ID: 7205
Reply to: 7203
The Dominus’ 15K miles oil service.
After the Dominus fluid refilling the cables sound bright as it was brand new but this brightness burns away much faster than when a cable was new, approximately twice faster. Over the years I was asking Jim to introduce replenishment kits, some kind of syringes where the cable could be refilled on locations once is a few years. He never did it. Some of the cables are fine and hold the fluid but some loose it and need to be refilled once in a whale. What is also interesting that the PAD cables when they dried out do NOT necessarily sound inferior compare to the PAD cables that fully charged with fluid. I remember I was asking Jim about it and he explanted that the “fumes” of the barbecued sauce that they fill up the cable still there even after the fluid is gone.

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
04-14-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
glaesemann
New York
Posts 22
Joined on 12-18-2007

Post #: 9
Post ID: 7206
Reply to: 7205
Refill kits = not good profit model.
I think we know why Purist does not send out refill kits. For the same reason HP and Canon do not send out ink refill kits.

I'm glad to hear about the fumes factoid. I think if I drank the barbecue sauce my body could produce some interesting fumes to try in the cable. A refill kit of a sort, no?

Tim


"I'd rather know than believe." - Carl Sagan
04-14-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,534
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 10
Post ID: 7207
Reply to: 7206
A wrong premise about the aquarium cables.
 glaesemann wrote:
I think we know why Purist does not send out refill kits. For the same reason HP and Canon do not send out ink refill kits.
You are incorrect. Diminus comes with lifetime warranty and Purist refill own cables for free if necessary. Even if you damage the cables or break up those extremely vulnerable RCA connectors (a constant pain in ass with Dominus) and PAD charges to restore your cable then it is not really a heavy burden price – shipping and downtime usualy more expensive. So, my proposal to have refilling kits was not something that take money out of Purist’s pocket but rather a convenient mechanism that would allow do not disturb the settled cables. The best Diminus I have seen are those with crystals growing in them…

The caT


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
04-14-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
glaesemann
New York
Posts 22
Joined on 12-18-2007

Post #: 11
Post ID: 7209
Reply to: 7207
Point taken.
Point taken.

Roman, you are correct and I was wrong. Even for the secondhand, non-warranty market it is not expensive. James just emailed me that it only costs $100 to fill 2.0 meters of Dominus Rev. B. Clearly not a profit driven service.


"I'd rather know than believe." - Carl Sagan
04-30-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,534
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 12
Post ID: 7338
Reply to: 7207
The dried out Purist
Actually I need to correct myself. The purist with leaked out fluid do not change sound with the fully filed cables. The completely dried out cans with no residue of the fluid at all do have sonic results. The dried out Purist has a typical unpleasant lower MF inflammation and this inflammation is more like a lower MF noise. The dried out Purist need to be re-filled.

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
05-16-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,534
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 13
Post ID: 7405
Reply to: 7131
A custom live wire in low viscosity fluid?

Moved Reply to the linked thread:

 glaesemann wrote:
In the past you've referred to current loading in the context of cable length. I recently experienced this when I experimented with moving my amps. I needed to increase the IC length from 1 meter to 3 meters. The only IC I had at that length was an old Colossus. To my surprise (after settling in) the Colossus at 3 meters was more interesting than the Proteus at 1 meter. I knew that the very low output impedance of the Placette Active made it a great preamp for driving longer length RCA's, but I didn't expect it to sound more interesting.

Though this is off topic from the thread, I'll try a response to your cable frustration (one that I share). Does the specific sound you are looking for exist in an IC you already own? The older Dominus or Proteus fluid Rev, A or B? By benefit of the Japanese documented Proteus dissection, we know how a Proteus Rev. B is made. The trick is the fluid, but a serious lab analysis could show the composition. They may have used an off the shelf fluid, like a brake fluid. Since they used an off the shelf inner cable (still available) for the Proteus, maybe a dissection of the Dominus would show the same thing. The Japanese have already documented the build of the cable from their dissection, so all there is left is to Cryo all of the parts and find someone to build it, like you've done with the tweeters, horns, etc. I'll suggest J.D. of Jade Audio. He builds cables of his own design in his home and is most noted for his solid gold stranded IC's. No copper and no silver. He is not a normal cable builder in one special way. He published exactly how he builds them and even has given direction to interested DYIers in the past, not to mention he is most assuredly not profit motivated. He is in very poor health and the demand for Jade cables has increased, so I can't speak to his availability, but it is worth a shot. The whole endeavor shouldn't cost too much. Purist may not be happy, but it's not your fault that they discontinued the Rev. A and B's.

Tim



 glaesemann wrote:
Does the specific sound you are looking for exist in an IC you already own? The older Dominus or Proteus fluid Rev, A or B?

Yes, Dominus RevA and RevB were right cables with exception of those Rev B that were converted from fluid to sand material that Purist promoted at that time. I would like to have the fluided Dominus RevA and RevB to be slightly more cables in the very lowest end, the very lowest octave, but with loosing the stunning Dominus’ midbass and everything else. I did not know any cable that can do it but late years when I went into multiamping I stopped care about it.

 glaesemann wrote:
By benefit of the Japanese documented Proteus dissection, we know how a Proteus Rev. B is made.

I do not know anything about it. Can you provide a link? I have somebody who can read Japanese.

 glaesemann wrote:
The trick is the fluid, but a serious lab analysis could show the composition. They may have used an off the shelf fluid, like a brake fluid.

I do not think that the fluid is a big deal. I think the fluidness of the isolation is the key, I would use different liquid. In my past I tried silicon and Scotch Whisky and the result was very good. Would it be possible to have even better sounding fluid then what Purist users? I think so. Purist puts their wires in plastic isolators and then submerges them in their fluid. I do not like it. I would like to have naked live conductors floating in fluid. Use none corrosive fluid for instance the silicon fluid in silicon tubing… I consulted with scientific-oriented person and he advised me to use different type of oil to live wires. Anyhow, although I am interested to learn what kind antifreeze of brake fluid Purist uses and even I have access to the infrared spectroscope but I would not go for analyzing the Purist’s fluid in RevA and RevB. I feel it would not be right thing to do.

 glaesemann wrote:
Since they used an off the shelf inner cable (still available) for the Proteus, maybe a dissection of the Dominus would show the same thing. The Japanese have already documented the build of the cable from their dissection, so all there is left is to Cryo all of the parts and find someone to build it, like you've done with the tweeters, horns, etc. I'll suggest J.D. of Jade Audio. He builds cables of his own design in his home and is most noted for his solid gold stranded IC's. No copper and no silver. He is not a normal cable builder in one special way. He published exactly how he builds them and even has given direction to interested DYIers in the past, not to mention he is most assuredly not profit motivated. He is in very poor health and the demand for Jade cables has increased, so I can't speak to his availability, but it is worth a shot. The whole endeavor shouldn't cost too much. Purist may not be happy, but it's not your fault that they discontinued the Rev. A and B's.

Tim, it is all very interesting and I would like to learn about the Proteus’ inner wire juts for a sake of general education on the subject. However, I would not go for a duplication of what Purist did. Doing it you will save only money but there are more important in our live things then juts to save money. I would feel like shit using those duplicated Purist cables. It is not to mention that Purist is no my enemy and Jim Aud always was very cooperative with all my requests. If I build myself or if I sponsor somebody to build custom cable for me then it will not come from Purist know-how. It will be using fluid most likely but it will be all that would relate my cable with original Purist cables. 

Rgs, the Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
05-16-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
glaesemann
New York
Posts 22
Joined on 12-18-2007

Post #: 14
Post ID: 7406
Reply to: 7405
Correction and the Romy Cat Signature Dominus
 Romy the Cat wrote:
Tim, it is all very interesting and I would like to learn about the Proteus’ inner wire juts for a sake of general education on the subject. However, I would not go for a duplication of what Purist did. Doing it you will save only money but there are more important in our live things then juts to save money.
Save money? No that is not in my point at all. If that was the point I too would feel like shit. Since you are so frustrated I assumed you already asked Jim to build you a 2 meter RCA Dominus Rev. A. If they can't (or won't) then what can you do? If the Rev. A is discontinued and they will not make you one, then how are you hurting them to duplicate it for your own use? If I was Purist I would take your $10,000 and build you the damn cable! To your spec! ...and then release it to the public as the Romy Cat signature Dominus. :-) - T


"I'd rather know than believe." - Carl Sagan
05-16-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,534
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 15
Post ID: 7407
Reply to: 7406
The Purist’s Problems

Tim,

you see I have no specification that the cable might be built I have only requirements. I have no idea what kind cable making specifications should be consider in order a cable yield this or that sound. Purist does build custom cables but primary within the scope of what they built commercially. I afraid that what I would be asking would be beyond of what they willing to do. Purist after all is a company that in the business of cable manufacturing not in the business of walking on water….

There are two more aspects that are making me do not contact Purist with my recent cable needs.

First is the price. It is not the fact that it is expensive itself but it is expensive by topology. If Purist wish to get let say $12.000 for interconnect then I am willing to spend $12.000 for hard-binding putting my DAC with my preamp, illuminating a need for a cable all together. So, investing $12.000 into a topological modification makes more sense to me.

The second is the more important. In the end of 90s purist made Dominus, Proteus, Colossus and they symbolized for us – the Purist users and producers – some sort of reference to an agreeable command denominator of sonic quality. Later on that common mutuality understandable protocol between the Purist’s products and the actual sound from the cables was shaken and then got destroyed. Nowadays you can but some kind of strange cable that have Dominus of Proteus label but that sound like shit. Furthermore Purist themselves are lost (in my view) a feeling of what is good and what is bad. They constantly release new cables and they feel that they are superior to the old cables but it is not just true. It is not that Purist lost my credibility: I do not care about the company I care about myself. I do have two cables RevB that are dried out and that need to do refilled but I afraid to send it to Purist and they might lose the Right sound. Purist use nowadays a new liquid and go figure if that liquid make the cable to sound right. Purist said that it does but the same Purist said many other things nowadays that in my experience just are not correct.

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
05-16-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Paul S
San Diego, California, USA
Posts 2,143
Joined on 10-12-2006

Post #: 16
Post ID: 7409
Reply to: 7407
Capacitor oil?
JUst a thought I've been sitting on for a while.

No, I've never tried finding the stuff.

Some kind of mineral oil with excelent dielectric properties.

Paul S
05-16-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Paul S
San Diego, California, USA
Posts 2,143
Joined on 10-12-2006

Post #: 17
Post ID: 7410
Reply to: 7409
But you're kidding about the Scotch, right?
Romy, I am aware that you don't kid around as much as some people might think, but I have known you to do it.

Scotch =/> 50% H20.

So, if you are in fact using Scotch to "good effect" (for the PADs; not for listening sessions...), then I guess this pretty much casts another shadow on the "dielectric"  idea.

FWIW, I not only Litz braid my own IC from POCC "magnet wire", but I melt bees wax over the braid.

This means the idea of wire "damping" is not lost on me.

But, using a +/- conductive fluid to encase/damp the wire?

How'z that work?

This from a guy who thinks twice before using a Ferrite bead...

Best regards,
Paul S
05-21-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,534
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 18
Post ID: 7427
Reply to: 7405
The cable that I am playing now.

 Romy the Cat wrote:
I do not think that the fluid is a big deal. I think the fluidness of the isolation is the key, I would use different liquid. In my past I tried silicon and Scotch Whisky and the result was very good. Would it be possible to have even better sounding fluid then what Purist users? I think so. Purist puts their wires in plastic isolators and then submerges them in their fluid. I do not like it. I would like to have naked live conductors floating in fluid. Use none corrosive fluid for instance the silicon fluid in silicon tubing… I consulted with scientific-oriented person and he advised me to use different type of oil to live wires. Anyhow, although I am interested to learn what kind antifreeze of brake fluid Purist uses and even I have access to the infrared spectroscope but I would not go for analyzing the Purist’s fluid in RevA and RevB. I feel it would not be right thing to do.
All my Purist semi-mimicking ideas of conductors floating in liquid are materialized in a cable that I am playing now with. It is a tube filed with grease or oil, sealed and RCA-terminated, ready to plug in play pair of those cables is available commercially at cost $25 in China.

Chinese_Purist.jpg

I am not commenting on the sound of this cable at this point: first because the cable is too new and second because I do not want to.  I am sick from visitors of my site who run across this site and send to me those emails in search for recommendations what to buy. I inform about my play with this Chinese Proteus only as information but not as recommendation.

Rgs, Romy the Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
05-21-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
glaesemann
New York
Posts 22
Joined on 12-18-2007

Post #: 19
Post ID: 7428
Reply to: 7427
RCA Termination
Interesting, at this stage it's early in your testing so I am mostly interested in how they are terminated. Can you provide a picture of how the fluid tubes are sealed and the cable terminated to RCA?

Tim


"I'd rather know than believe." - Carl Sagan
05-22-2008 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,534
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 20
Post ID: 7429
Reply to: 7428
There us truly nothing special in there
It is tube filed with ail and patched with some kind of sealing none-solidifying transparent glue – you would hardly see where oil stops and the glue begin. On the ends - juts regular audio RCAs. There is nothing truly special or remarkable – it should cost perhaps a few dollars more then the cost of the similar length wire.

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
Page 1 of 2 (25 items) Select Pages:  1 2 »
   Target    Threads for related reading   Most recent post in related threads   Forum  Replies   Views   Started 
  »  New  The “Wet and Fuzzy” cable...  The “Wet and Fuzzy” cable....  Audio Discussions  Forum     0  10773  05-09-2008
  »  New  Cable Current Loading..  The Purist’s Problems...  Audio Discussions  Forum     5  24860  05-14-2008
  »  New  Chasing utopian better phono interconnect...  Did I miss something?...  Analog Playback Forum     6  77113  06-05-2008
  »  New  We who are about to die... (a cable thread)..  Double-twisting 2 1/2; a tail of synergy...  Audio Discussions  Forum     31  144593  06-28-2008
  »  New  FM and … cables…..  Nordost and the schmalts...  Off Air Audio Forum     2  23254  04-15-2009
  »  New  DSET and Cables...  DSET and Cables....  Audio Discussions  Forum     0  10548  02-23-2010
Home Page  |  Last 24Hours  | Search  |  SiteMap  | Questions or Problems | Copyright Note
The content of all messages within the Forums Copyright © by authors of the posts