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  »  New  My recent FM mystery..  Yamaha T-2...  Off Air Audio Forum     3  35139  07-25-2004
  »  New  Digital recorders: what the "big boys" use?..  Not that wild stuff...  Didital Things  Forum     13  78779  01-05-2005
  »  New  The best audio source EVER!..  Norway to close FM by 2017...  Off Air Audio Forum     34  188580  08-20-2005
  »  New  Where the FM quality comes from?..  Freaking ridicules…...  Off Air Audio Forum     22  125411  11-02-2005
  »  New  A littlie D-War: Bidat vs. Lavry Gold..  RE: the "New" DAC...  Didital Things  Forum     13  134033  12-18-2005
  »  New  Align your FM tuners!..  The Munich technician?...  Off Air Audio Forum     7  62061  03-27-2006
  »  New  Analogue to digital converter comparison..  And the price of this is?...  Didital Things  Forum     6  51170  03-16-2007
  »  New  Sansui TU-X1 Broadcast monitor...  Replace all audio coupling......  Off Air Audio Forum     46  320056  06-20-2007
  »  New  The best practices for DAW Data Storage...  The Time Stamps Directories Synchronizer...  Didital Things  Forum     9  50889  09-24-2007
  »  New  Recording options: Pacific Microsonics vs. Lavry Gold...  Pacific Microsonics vs. Lavry Gold in D/A mode....  Didital Things  Forum     24  181291  09-27-2007
  »  New  Reel-to-Reel Tape vs. Raw Better Digital..  So, the "format" and sub-generational stages/...  Didital Things  Forum     13  132279  11-16-2007
  »  New  The commercial music servers...  Touch screen remote...  Didital Things  Forum     37  228806  01-10-2008
  »  New  The Remote System Management..  Great little box...  Off Air Audio Forum     13  71384  08-12-2008
  »  New  Is anybody live in Australia with a tuner and an intere..  Use the same volume of signal...  Off Air Audio Forum     19  105948  09-19-2008
  »  New  How many Bits needed for FM, the Accuphase T1000 dilemm..  The Spider in the Bromeliad...  Off Air Audio Forum     6  46953  03-11-2009
  »  New  DC offset for A/D converters...  DC offset for A/D converters....  Didital Things  Forum     0  12176  03-13-2009
11-19-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
guy sergeant
United Kingdom
Posts 258
Joined on 08-03-2004

Post #: 61
Post ID: 1766
Reply to: 1760
Re: copyright issues...

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"FM is a public domain"

I'd imagine if some less than scrupulous individual took to recording live broadcasts and then produced extremely high quality audio CD's from them for general sale, the performers and the radio station might have something to say about it!

What an interesting idea though.

I'm not sure I'll be at CES next time but if you do produce such a disc I'd be delighted to receive a copy to play on the deserving speakers I have here! I'd be happy to make a contribution to your chosen feline protection charity.

By the way, how did you record the broadcast excerpt from Shostakovich V that was on the 'sampler' disc you sent a few months ago?

best regards,

Guy
11-19-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
cv
Derby, United Kingdom
Posts 173
Joined on 09-15-2004

Post #: 62
Post ID: 1767
Reply to: 1762
Re: Troughline Tuner
Thanks for the tips Guy...a friend of mine knows this local guy who has a stack of radios, including troughlines, and  he should be able to supply me with a nicely aligned one.

In the meantime, I will give classic fm another shot...

Funny what you mentioned about bass - that was the first thing that struck me about the Cat's samples.

Best,
Chris
11-19-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,535
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 63
Post ID: 1768
Reply to: 1767
I’m happy pussy!

OK, now it looks like that I finally finalized my first experimental draft of FM recoding setup. The AD122, outputting the 24/96 stream, into PC’s uncompressed WAV files via Lynx 16 interface. For the time being I decide to use the DA924 as D/A. With all beauty of DA924 I did not fine it comfortable to handle CEC TL0 and I feel that Bidat does better in there. (Although Bidat vs DA924 is VERY big and VERY separate question). Ironically when the DA924 run the “narrow lock” after the AD122 it perfumes very nice, primary, I think because the FM has no UHF information to begin with…

Anyhow, it looks like all is set here and the only thing that I need at this point is a recording software that would accept any OLE or COM or COM+ or .NET interface as I would like to activate recording process by sending email… Alternatively I might tonal it via VPN but full remote automation sounds more desirable.

The programming on December looks very nice and the hard disk space is cheap...

I’m happy pussy!
The Romy


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
11-19-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
guy sergeant
United Kingdom
Posts 258
Joined on 08-03-2004

Post #: 64
Post ID: 1770
Reply to: 1767
Re: Get a good aerial
I don't know where you are Chris but get a decent aerial for it mounted on the roof if you can manage it. There was some great stuff on R3 today including a comparison of many of the best versions of the Brahms clarinet trio and some tremendous live Jazz from the London Jazz festival. Even better because it's all free.

I'll be interested to hear how you get on. I think you'll be amazed by what it'll do.

It has an inbuilt volume control so I run mine directly into the power amps.

best regards,

Guy
11-20-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,535
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 65
Post ID: 1773
Reply to: 1644
Another mystery of PC Audio.

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How came that I can’t write a file longer then 2G? As I remember form past, the FAT partition had limitation of 2G but my drives are NTFS formatted and it should not be an issues. Perhaps a WAV file has by nature 2G limits, doesn’t it? If this is the case then it is not good as 24/96 eats a lot of hard disk space. Any solution? The entire idea to record for instance an opera “live” that later on if you are “in a mood” then you could experience it "live", without flipping those records, without changing those disks or without reloading those files…

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
11-20-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Antonio J.
Madrid, Spain
Posts 272
Joined on 08-16-2004

Post #: 66
Post ID: 1774
Reply to: 1773
Software limitation?
I have been able to produce video files longer than 4Gb 7,5 Gb if I don't recall wrongly. Wav files shouldn't be any different. Are you using the All sound recorder XP? Maybe using other software it can be overcome or just changing some setting in its preferences.

Rgrds,

A
11-21-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
TonyB
Toronto
Posts 22
Joined on 04-14-2005

Post #: 67
Post ID: 1776
Reply to: 1768
Re: I’m happy pussy!

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Hi Romy,
 Romy the Cat wrote:

For the time being I decide to use the DA924 as D/A. With all beauty of DA924 I did not fine it comfortable to handle CEC TL0 and I feel that Bidat does better in there. (Although Bidat vs DA924 is VERY big and VERY separate question).



That would be a very interesting comparison. How about a new thread?

TonyB
11-21-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,535
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 68
Post ID: 1777
Reply to: 1776
The LPs and CDs garage sale is coming...
 TonyB wrote:
Hi Romy, That would be a very interesting comparison. How about a new thread?
So far it is not “interesting comparison” but the painfull one and I still in process to figure out the things… I use the Larvy’s DAC it 96kHz where Bidat dose not operate. At the 44.1/20bit my Bidat hold it’s own against Larvy’s 924. However, at 24/96kHz, recorded from the FM broadcasts and with all Larvys in the chain the quality is mind-boggling. Does anyhow want to buy my LPs and CDs?

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
11-22-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Antonio J.
Madrid, Spain
Posts 272
Joined on 08-16-2004

Post #: 69
Post ID: 1778
Reply to: 1777
Post a list and we can speak

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LOL. I don't think you'll ever sell your LP's. Maybe you would sell the CDs after ripping them into the computer, but the vinyls..... I wouldn't do. In any case, let us know ;-)

Rgrds,

A
11-22-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
guy sergeant
United Kingdom
Posts 258
Joined on 08-03-2004

Post #: 70
Post ID: 1779
Reply to: 1777
Re: The LPs and CDs garage sale is coming...
Hi Romy,

Can you describe how your vinyl playback and conventional CD playback fall short of what you are getting from FM? Is the FM playback of 'non live' material still sounding better than your vinyl and cd?  Have you tried recording vinyl with the Lavry?

I shall be trying a low budget experiment along similar lines tomorrow burning a cd directly from a live BBC Radio 3 concert (from the Leak tuner)via a relatively cheap Tascam CD Recorder. It will be interesting to see how much of the 'live' FM quality is preserved by this machine. Obviously it's not 24 96 standard but I'm interested to see whether the good aspects of the FM transmission are still preserved.

best regards,

Guy
11-22-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,535
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 71
Post ID: 1780
Reply to: 1779
More FM propaganda...

 guy sergeant wrote:
Can you describe how your vinyl playback and conventional CD playback fall short of what you are getting from FM?

Guy, you are asking a resemble question but what do you expect me to say? Do you expect me to convince you (or myself) that FM is totally different (including many “hidden” not obvious reasons) and way more advanced media then recorded music? Would I need to do the convincing? You see, a lot of people out there talk about audio with one or another level of authority and credibility and I very frequently approach to all that “taking” with very high level of skepticism. Why? Because I have seen and heard the actual results that the people are getting out there while they run this months. Probably I would approach with the same skepticism my own comments about the FM… until I had the tangible evidences that were able to assess by myself.  Therefore instead of reading my comments about the vinyl/CD vs FM how about I send you a WAV file with one of my recent recordings, no mater how premature those recordings are… There is a catch in here. Since I started my FM paranoia and have quite a few people connected me, some of them sent me the examples by my request. Thos people do claim that FM is very good but not at the point of my exuberant glorification. I agree with them because a have heard thier files and because none of them demonstrated any interesting (from my prospective) FM sound. I do not know why I have better result even at 20/44, but I do like my result better and in a way “different”. Anyhow, all that I might propose is send you a file and it you have a good sound digital interfaces would be the judge. Send me your address and feel free to share with other your finding after you listen the recording.

 guy sergeant wrote:
Is the FM playback of 'non live' material still sounding better than your vinyl and cd?

Yes, it does. Most of the time when the stations broadcast well and use good sources.

 guy sergeant wrote:
Have you tried recording vinyl with the Lavry?

Nope, I did not.

 guy sergeant wrote:
I shall be trying a low budget experiment along similar lines tomorrow burning a cd directly from a live BBC Radio 3 concert (from the Leak tuner)via a relatively cheap Tascam CD Recorder. It will be interesting to see how much of the 'live' FM quality is preserved by this machine. Obviously it's not 24 96 standard but I'm interested to see whether the good aspects of the FM transmission are still preserved.

I am VERY skeptical that you might get any interesting result form it. You see, what I found so far, that as soon you put the uncompress VAW file to CD and convert it into whatever format the CD burners could accept then sound flying away form this recording with the speed of light. Record it to uncompress file and play it form there. DO NOT dump it to CD…

The Cat




"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
11-23-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Bud
upper left crust united snakes
Posts 87
Joined on 07-07-2005

Post #: 72
Post ID: 1781
Reply to: 1780
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Romy,
What is the possibility of just dumping the wav files to cd as a data disc?
Not as a red book audio file, just a copy from your HD. Or, we could just start sending you our spare hard drives for data dumps, I have two 30 gigs laying about uselessly. Or maybe a dump to DVD formatted discs, as the gamming mags do, to allow 4 gig on a CD.

It would be nice to have a playable format in our CD players but we might be able to manage....
Bud
11-23-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,535
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 73
Post ID: 1782
Reply to: 1781
It is the way to go.
 Bud wrote:
Romy,
What is the possibility of just dumping the wav files to cd as a data disc?
Not as a red book audio file, just a copy from your HD. Or, we could just start sending you our spare hard drives for data dumps, I have two 30 gigs laying about uselessly. Or maybe a dump to DVD formatted discs, as the gamming mags do, to allow 4 gig on a CD.
It would be nice to have a playable format in our CD players but we might be able to manage....
Bud
It was exactly what I meant: juts dump the window files to CD or DVD, send it out, load files to HD and play form there. No CD ever evolved. With a reasonable I/O interface, taking data to external good DAC is very easy… The only thing that I am sorry is that I did not realized early how good music could be recorded and how high quality might be from the FM. Wait until you get the files (although I owe you some music already). BTW, Bud, it would be very interesting to hear your as the Suresh’s observation about sound of those files in context of your guys hyper-sensitively to the digital chain…

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
11-23-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Handful of Qubits
Posts 4
Joined on 07-09-2004

Post #: 74
Post ID: 1783
Reply to: 1782
Re: digital playback

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Romy, I would be delighted to hear some of these recordings from your FM receiver. Unfortunately, here in the San Francisco Bay Area, we have no good classical radio station. There is one classical station, highly commercial and apparently with the credo "All Mozart, All The Time". We do have a good jazz station and some entertaining college stations, but I miss good public classical radio from back East.

Copying the high-bitrate WAV files to a DVD-R or CD-R makes a lot of sense, of course. I will just have to find a decent DAC to decode them - my current one is fairly old and tops out at 48kHz. Maybe a Lavry Blue...those are almost affordable.

Your enthusiasm for FM radio is encouraging. I have heard some lovely sound out of radio, and I've wanted to explore that direction for some time. There's a radio station that broadcasts from the hifi show in Montreal each year, then picks up their own (uncompressed, high quality) signal and plays it back for people on headphone setups. People are always amazed at how nice it can sound - FM doesn't have to be compressed, low-fidelity garbage.
11-23-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
guy sergeant
United Kingdom
Posts 258
Joined on 08-03-2004

Post #: 75
Post ID: 1784
Reply to: 1782
Re: .WAV files from audio cd's
Forgive my ignorance...

Is there any benefit to be had from making and playing back .wav files derived from normal audio cd's?  Is the damage done in making them into 'red book' audio cd's in the first place irreversible? 

Guy
11-23-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Handful of Qubits
Posts 4
Joined on 07-09-2004

Post #: 76
Post ID: 1785
Reply to: 1784
Re: benefits of .WAV files from audio cd's
While you cannot overcome the limitations of 44.1kHz, 16bit PCM audio format by ripping from CD to .WAV, you can still find some benefit. For one example, dirty or scratched (cat-chewed?) CDs can often be recovered with error correction algorithms in good CD ripping software, which would be unplayable in realtime on a standard CD player. Also, a PC with a pro sound card and wordclock sync may well be a better transport than most consumer or audiophile CD players. Finally, I find it very convenient to have all my digital music stored on hard disk for easy access, sorting, and inventory.
12-02-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,535
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 77
Post ID: 1813
Reply to: 1785
How to play 88.2/24 Wav file.
I made recently a few interesting FM recordings and thought to post the fragments of them on my site but I learned that a regular Windows Media Player would not play them. I do not know if it was the codex issues or just the Windows Media Player dose not play 88.2/24. On my PC I play if from the WaveLab but what should I do on a regula PC. I can play it on Windows Media Player if I downgrade it to 16/44 but a lot of get lost while I do it. Could someone suggest any plug-in or something that would also to play 88.2/24 in regular consumer PC.

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
12-02-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Antonio J.
Madrid, Spain
Posts 272
Joined on 08-16-2004

Post #: 78
Post ID: 1814
Reply to: 1813
Soundcard player
If the soundcard supports playback of those files, the player included with it should play them. Jetaudio is a versatile player, it supports up to 32 bits files, but not in wav format :-( Maybe iTunes would play them, give it a try.

Regards,

AJ
12-20-2006 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Max Shatsky
Posts 19
Joined on 01-03-2005

Post #: 79
Post ID: 3322
Reply to: 1814
Stand Alone PC for Audio Playback (AudioFile -> Lynx 16 -> External DAC)
Hi,

I'm thinking to put up a PC to just play audio files (I'm not interesting in any kind of recording).
From the previous  discussions  it seems that a good digital interface can be Lynx AES 16.
My first question is about quality. Considering only 16/44 format files, what kind of
difference (in sound quality) I get between these two options:

1) WAV file X burned on CD-R and played on CD player Y.
2) The same file X played on PC -> Lynx AES 16 -> DAC of cd-player Y.

Of course there is a factor of transport quality of cd-player Y, so lets assume that it is relatively good, and a burned CDR is average to good.

Second question is about convenience.
Most of the files I want to play are either in FLAC or APE formats. Popular windows software players (like Nero) can play at least FLAC (I haven't tried APE yet) through my Creative SoundaBlaster card.
Will I be able to play FLAC/APE through Lynx AES16?  Is anything special in using Lynx in Windows? It seems that it doesn't have DAC inside, so it should be somewhat different from a regular PC sound-card.

I appreciate any feedback.
12-20-2006 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,535
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 80
Post ID: 3326
Reply to: 3322
How extensive a dedicated audio workstation should be?

Hi, Max.

When you say “WAV file X burned on CD-R” then the question would be what was the source of those files? If you have a row source with some kind of A/D and if you intend to stay with 44 then 44/20 is OK format, do not stay with for 16 Bit. However, if source for your files are other ripped CDs then it is more complicated because it is severely compromised from beginning. 

My transport (CEC-TL0) reads better quality then my CD-ROM. (The CD-ROM is selected among 22 of it’s competitors – do not ask me how it happed – it did happed). So, on the scale of quality I would put this hierarchy with the best atop:

1) Direct feed, A/D writing WAV files and then to play them
2) CD readers (from TL0)
3) WAV file burned from other CD
4) CD played directly from CD reader

Anyhow, if you have an abstract 16/44 file, regardless of the source, then what would be an optimum configuration to do it? I think the fist thing you need to decide how much hassles are you wiling to endure to play 16Bit files. Lynx AES 16 is fine and there are a number of other good external DACs out there but …it is still 16Bit! I presume that nowadays it would be possible to find a good 16Bit on-board DAC. I really do not know what it out there and I did not make my own research in the subject. I went for “big” external DAC because the  “comfort” was not my objective. So, in my case it is a dedicated DAW with Lynx interface, externals DAC, grounds, ugly playing software and so on… I defiantly would NOT go for it is I use the ripped CD  16-bit CDs as a source….

So, after I successfully failed to say anything meaningful to your first question let go for the second one…

I do not know anything about any other lossless formats, I used only WAVs. I would refer you to Lynx manual (or to the manual of any other card you might pick). BTW, Lynx has very friendly and very knowledgeable support team and they are very nice on a phone… Lynx has also the same class card only with built-in premium DACs on it. They claimed that the DACs as very good but I personally do not know if it is correct. Ironically the card with DACs cost the same as a digital interface with no processing on the card.

Hence, generally I do not know what to answer. I had very limited exposure to the subject (well documented with this site). Still, even my extremely limited exposure was 2 years back and it is a LOT on digital world. I heard that nowadays even the head-held devices or laptops with premium audio cards could do good 16bit. I heard that some people use even consumer sound card or pro-video processing machines and get good 16Bit of them

Max, perhaps I wrong but I do not remember you as a me-like-psycho who has interest in “abstract” audio. I hardly feel that juts ripping CDs and play then from DAW would require anything “special”. At least it was my experience… General rule that I would follow is making DAW as “complex” in term of quality and extendibility as your CD playback… I think it would make sense…

Rgs,
Romy the Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
Page 4 of 7 (126 items) Select Pages:  « First ... « 2 3 4 5 6 » ... Last »
   Target    Threads for related reading   Most recent post in related threads   Forum  Replies   Views   Started 
  »  New  My recent FM mystery..  Yamaha T-2...  Off Air Audio Forum     3  35139  07-25-2004
  »  New  Digital recorders: what the "big boys" use?..  Not that wild stuff...  Didital Things  Forum     13  78779  01-05-2005
  »  New  The best audio source EVER!..  Norway to close FM by 2017...  Off Air Audio Forum     34  188580  08-20-2005
  »  New  Where the FM quality comes from?..  Freaking ridicules…...  Off Air Audio Forum     22  125411  11-02-2005
  »  New  A littlie D-War: Bidat vs. Lavry Gold..  RE: the "New" DAC...  Didital Things  Forum     13  134033  12-18-2005
  »  New  Align your FM tuners!..  The Munich technician?...  Off Air Audio Forum     7  62061  03-27-2006
  »  New  Analogue to digital converter comparison..  And the price of this is?...  Didital Things  Forum     6  51170  03-16-2007
  »  New  Sansui TU-X1 Broadcast monitor...  Replace all audio coupling......  Off Air Audio Forum     46  320056  06-20-2007
  »  New  The best practices for DAW Data Storage...  The Time Stamps Directories Synchronizer...  Didital Things  Forum     9  50889  09-24-2007
  »  New  Recording options: Pacific Microsonics vs. Lavry Gold...  Pacific Microsonics vs. Lavry Gold in D/A mode....  Didital Things  Forum     24  181291  09-27-2007
  »  New  Reel-to-Reel Tape vs. Raw Better Digital..  So, the "format" and sub-generational stages/...  Didital Things  Forum     13  132279  11-16-2007
  »  New  The commercial music servers...  Touch screen remote...  Didital Things  Forum     37  228806  01-10-2008
  »  New  The Remote System Management..  Great little box...  Off Air Audio Forum     13  71384  08-12-2008
  »  New  Is anybody live in Australia with a tuner and an intere..  Use the same volume of signal...  Off Air Audio Forum     19  105948  09-19-2008
  »  New  How many Bits needed for FM, the Accuphase T1000 dilemm..  The Spider in the Bromeliad...  Off Air Audio Forum     6  46953  03-11-2009
  »  New  DC offset for A/D converters...  DC offset for A/D converters....  Didital Things  Forum     0  12176  03-13-2009
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