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  »  New  What lives in Symmetric Sound?..  The beginning of our journey is ALWAYS symmetrical...  Audio Discussions  Forum     19  158458  05-28-2004
  »  New  Always check power-line polarity...  The Cost of Knowing...  Audio For Dummies ™  Forum     11  96676  07-10-2005
  »  New  RAAL “Water Drop” tweeter for Macondo...  Your comment takes me by surprise...  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     77  856730  02-16-2007
  »  New  My feelings about new exciting audio products..  Vacuumstate...  Audio Discussions  Forum     25  243890  04-30-2007
  »  New  Musique Concrete horns..  These are now sold as Kornhent products...  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     6  99434  06-12-2007
  »  New  Compression drivers and the “clean signal”...  The NEW “Compression drivers and the clean signal”....  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     14  148899  07-12-2007
  »  New  Digi Redux; Drive 1 transport and iDAT-44+ DAC..  Ha! It might have lasted FOREVER!...  Didital Things  Forum     25  204032  09-28-2007
  »  New  Metal domes..  Try the one Lansche is using...  Audio Discussions  Forum     6  72551  11-08-2007
  »  New  The power AC Outlets?..  Where to Pick Up the Gong?...  Audio Discussions  Forum     2  39690  10-31-2008
  »  New  The Avicenna's failure is the great Avicenna success!..  New life for Avicenna...  Audio Discussions  Forum     8  76320  02-03-2009
  »  New  Internet and electricity..  Suboptimal. . ....  Didital Things  Forum     1  26110  01-07-2010
  »  New  Electricity... power strips and ac improvements..  Electricity... power strips and ac improvements...  Audio Discussions  Forum     0  15077  03-30-2010
  »  New  Another example of energy..  ABB UPS (PowerValue 31/11T 20 kVA 18,000W)...  Audio Discussions  Forum     1888  8787490  01-29-2011
  »  New  I good spot-light for a turntable?..  Reply...  Analog Playback Forum     15  140558  10-24-2010
09-26-2022 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Paul S
San Diego, California, USA
Posts 2,467
Joined on 10-12-2006

Post #: 1881
Post ID: 26907
Reply to: 26906
The Sound of Music
Rick, good question. Probably few people at this forum think seriously about power supplies; you might get more answers on DIY forum. Of course, the only thing we care about is our experiences with the Music, however that happens, which certainly does not preclude developing "good sounding" power supplies, but this seems to requiire a lot of rigor, and pretty good ideas about what one is listening to, in the first place. Putting anything "outside" the personal experiences of the listener makes it just an excercise, rather than a means to a Musical end. Again, I have yet to hear a "totally corrected", pro-type set-up making Music I want to listen to. Outside of that, my interest wanes. 

Best regards,
Paul S
09-26-2022 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
rickmcinnis
Posts 59
Joined on 10-18-2010

Post #: 1882
Post ID: 26908
Reply to: 26907
Doing it yourself since there is no other choice
I know the proprietor despises cheap DIY and I do, too.  DIY should be a response to not being satisfied with what the market offers - not a cheap way to have something to listen to.

All the while his system stands as a pinnacle of what one man can do for himself.  So I thought there was a bit of interest in what makes sound musical.

No one needs another DIYAudio - one is plenty.  Not to say it does not have a place.

There seems to be be some tinkerers here.  I have read of people building Romy's phono corrector circuit, amplifiers and takes inspired by the speaker system.

Unless they have all gone away. 
09-26-2022 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Paul S
San Diego, California, USA
Posts 2,467
Joined on 10-12-2006

Post #: 1883
Post ID: 26909
Reply to: 26908
Application
Big differences between PS in my giant amps and my DAC, my passive attenuator and my phono stage, TT. PS has to be "good enough" for the application. Maybe "reverse engineered" from the demands end requirements (ie, the mind of the listener). Throw those out there. What are you after? Cheap or expensive, DIY as an end in itself, electronics, specs, does not get much traction around here. Ironically, some of the best ideas on this entire site are buried in long-winded discussions about all sorts of things... other than DIY.

Best regards,
Paul S
09-26-2022 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
rickmcinnis
Posts 59
Joined on 10-18-2010

Post #: 1884
Post ID: 26910
Reply to: 26909
I was speaking of amplifier output stages, generally
Unless they are quite unusual I doubt your amplifier's output stage uses regulated supplies.

My point was that PUREPOWER/Inverters, etc. deliver a far more constant AC voltage than the line and that this could be a  reason people find them to be useful.  They have stabilized the voltage on the output stage. I assume most high quality amplifiers these days are employing voltage regulation on the input stage/s.  Though the MELQUAIDES amplifier has no voltage regulation other than chokes and resistors and I safely assume it is a very fine sounding amplifier.  But I would wonder, without PUREPOWER as the source of its AC, would its sound be compromised by more than AC junk but by the inconstancy of the voltage?

I went from there to speculate that this same quality might allow one to NOT use regulators which can mess up the sound compared to good old chokes.  At least in audio lore this is the case and is quite obvious when one is speaking of three terminal regulators.

Would a constant AC line voltage negate the need for complicated regulators in ;pw level voltage amplification circuits?  Have no feel for how this could affect a digital circuit.

To end, I must admit I am not quite sure what you are saying but hope the above clarifies what I intended to say.

09-26-2022 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Paul S
San Diego, California, USA
Posts 2,467
Joined on 10-12-2006

Post #: 1885
Post ID: 26911
Reply to: 26910
To Listen and To Hear Is To Learn
The bitch is, it takes so long to work through everything in your own system; but that's basically what it takes. If you go DSET system, like Melq, you may well be years away from getting it all up and running. And even once you are happy with your results, you might not have a full understanding of what exactly  "works" where, and why. I am not trying to be difficult, just not able to meaningfully answer in the abstract.

For input, I think "everyone uses chokes"...

The other classic hi-fi joke concerns new problems introduced by better fill-in-the-blank.


Best regards,
Paul S
10-22-2022 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Amir
Iran Tehran
Posts 260
Joined on 02-11-2009

Post #: 1886
Post ID: 26914
Reply to: 26911
Energy Storage , Battery vs Flywheels

Is there any body who used Flywheel power to supply UPS/Inverter?
https://www.piller.com/en-GB/183/energy-storage


10-24-2022 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
rickmcinnis
Posts 59
Joined on 10-18-2010

Post #: 1887
Post ID: 26922
Reply to: 26914
That is intriguing
But batteries are much simpler!

I would think those things make more than some noise so a remote location would be required which would make long AC lines a necessity.

I can see large installation making good use of this but not for most audio systems,

I guess this is basically a generator with a flywheel?  I did not see an obvious link to how it works. 

Once spun up how long would it remain spinning?  Would a heavy load drag it down quicker?  It would have to.  Is the motor to get it up to speed always on or does it cycle on and off?

My GIANDEL inverter has been working now for almost three months - it is silent in operation and keeps the AC at 123 v0olts +- 1 volt. More like +- 1/2 volt.

I got another smaller one to power the computer stuff since no one wanted my AGM batteries.  I do think there is an improvement with the computer powered by an inverter.

No question the AC line is detrimental to getting good sound from your system.  I thought i was blessed with good AC and now I realize no one is blessed with good AC.  One of those things that once you have learned to appreciate what it is doing you cannot listen without it.

10-24-2022 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Amir
Iran Tehran
Posts 260
Joined on 02-11-2009

Post #: 1888
Post ID: 26923
Reply to: 26922
Piller UPS
Piller UPS generate AC power but use Flywheel storage instead of battery

https://library.industrialsolutions.abb.com/publibrary/checkout/DEA-642?TNR=Brochures%7CDEA-642%7CPDF&filename=DEA-642.pdf


https://www.activepower.com/en-GB
12-29-2022 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Amir
Iran Tehran
Posts 260
Joined on 02-11-2009

Post #: 1889
Post ID: 27051
Reply to: 26923
ABB UPS (PowerValue 31/11T 20 kVA 18,000W)

Because of Purepower 3000 power was not enough for my high power ss system then I bought an ABB 18KW UPS.

Both APC and ABB are popular and my friend used APC and the sound of APC was not good and I choosed ABB to test between Wall AC and ABB.


ABB from Switzerland produce high quality UPS and last week I have listened to one of them (ABB 20KVA model) in my system.

After break-in process I have connected different parallel loads (500w, 4000w, 5700w) to ABB UPS to view what happen to sound quality.


ABB UPS vs Wall AC Power (when wall AC is good) :

ABB is like high power low impedance Mark Levinson Amplifier : clean but Compress , thin and damaged harmonics.

Wall AC power (when AC is good) is like Zero feedback good Amplifier : Rich Harmonic, dynamic and better more 3D Image


ABB has no limits in current delivery (18,000W , 100A) and it has superb jump and attack but no decay no harmonic no life in music.

you can feel the compression of sound when the ABB in online.


I do not know but I guess most UPS and Inverters like ABB , APC , ... use feedback to regulate voltage and their sound reminds me bad Computer playbacks.


Purepower is like bragin and If Richard had a 30,000VA purepower then I was his first customer. I told richard if he can help me to design a high power Purepower but I think it is not possible to him.


Totally I think no UPS in this market is good for sound.


In the next step I will go for testing Kevin power System. 12v battery + 6 parallel Victron Energy (total 18000VA).


If Victron will not be good then I will go for delicated 20/000v to 380v transformer .





Page 95 of 95 (1,889 items) Select Pages:  « First ... « 91 92 93 94 95
   Target    Threads for related reading   Most recent post in related threads   Forum  Replies   Views   Started 
  »  New  What lives in Symmetric Sound?..  The beginning of our journey is ALWAYS symmetrical...  Audio Discussions  Forum     19  158458  05-28-2004
  »  New  Always check power-line polarity...  The Cost of Knowing...  Audio For Dummies ™  Forum     11  96676  07-10-2005
  »  New  RAAL “Water Drop” tweeter for Macondo...  Your comment takes me by surprise...  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     77  856730  02-16-2007
  »  New  My feelings about new exciting audio products..  Vacuumstate...  Audio Discussions  Forum     25  243890  04-30-2007
  »  New  Musique Concrete horns..  These are now sold as Kornhent products...  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     6  99434  06-12-2007
  »  New  Compression drivers and the “clean signal”...  The NEW “Compression drivers and the clean signal”....  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     14  148899  07-12-2007
  »  New  Digi Redux; Drive 1 transport and iDAT-44+ DAC..  Ha! It might have lasted FOREVER!...  Didital Things  Forum     25  204032  09-28-2007
  »  New  Metal domes..  Try the one Lansche is using...  Audio Discussions  Forum     6  72551  11-08-2007
  »  New  The power AC Outlets?..  Where to Pick Up the Gong?...  Audio Discussions  Forum     2  39690  10-31-2008
  »  New  The Avicenna's failure is the great Avicenna success!..  New life for Avicenna...  Audio Discussions  Forum     8  76320  02-03-2009
  »  New  Internet and electricity..  Suboptimal. . ....  Didital Things  Forum     1  26110  01-07-2010
  »  New  Electricity... power strips and ac improvements..  Electricity... power strips and ac improvements...  Audio Discussions  Forum     0  15077  03-30-2010
  »  New  Another example of energy..  ABB UPS (PowerValue 31/11T 20 kVA 18,000W)...  Audio Discussions  Forum     1888  8787490  01-29-2011
  »  New  I good spot-light for a turntable?..  Reply...  Analog Playback Forum     15  140558  10-24-2010
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