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  »  New  Recording options: Pacific Microsonics vs. Lavry Gold...  Pacific Microsonics vs. Lavry Gold in D/A mode....  Didital Things  Forum     24  218682  09-27-2007
  »  New  The BSO and Digital Music...  Around the BSO recording practice....  Didital Things  Forum     44  265308  12-02-2008
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  »  New  The optimum Sampling Rate for bass...  Lynx can handle up to 200.000Khz...  Didital Things  Forum     3  32820  02-19-2008
  »  New  Analog Transfer: the first draft...  What I am after in this test....  Didital Things  Forum     19  126784  04-11-2006
  »  New  Weiss Engineering DAC202..  Attenuation...  Didital Things  Forum     5  40221  06-21-2010
  »  New  Pacific Microsonics Model Two: What Platform, Software ..  XLR to RCA adaptor. Watch out...  Didital Things  Forum     1  21277  03-17-2011
  »  New  Berkeley Audio Design's Alfa Reference DAC...  Well, it fits the pattern....  Didital Things  Forum     4  32077  09-02-2014
10-01-2009 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
manisandher
London
Posts 157
Joined on 09-05-2008

Post #: 61
Post ID: 11884
Reply to: 11883
Pacific's cons
fiogf49gjkf0d

The size, I can understand.

But can't you simply take the tape out from your Placette and plug it into the Pacific's analog inputs? I'm assuming that the Placette has, in addition to its variable output, a fixed output...

Surely this would help with the Pacific's low input impedance also, no?

Mani.

10-01-2009 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,734
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 62
Post ID: 11891
Reply to: 11884
The tape loop it is.
fiogf49gjkf0d
 manisandher wrote:
But can't you simply take the tape out from your Placette and plug it into the Pacific's analog inputs? I'm assuming that the Placette has, in addition to its variable output, a fixed output...
  
Yes, I have thought about it. My Placette has no tape loop but I think it needs to be added. It is shame that I did not think about it before – it would save me some cable not to mention an ability to run A/D from anything… I kind of mildly contemplating what would be better: a full tape loop or a full active tape buffer, but it is not the subject of this thread.

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
10-19-2009 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,734
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 63
Post ID: 12009
Reply to: 11891
Bye-Bye Placette….
fiogf49gjkf0d

 Romy the Cat wrote:
Yes, I have thought about it. My Placette has no tape loop but I think it needs to be added. It is shame that I did not think about it before – it would save me some cable not to mention an ability to run A/D from anything… I kind of mildly contemplating what would be better: a full tape loop or a full active tape buffer, but it is not the subject of this thread.

OK, I decided to do it and my beloved Placette is packed up and will be riding tomorrow back to the birth place for an installation of most likely a tape loop, I am still contemplating if a tape buffer will be better. The idea will be to have Pacific permanently bout to the Placette’s tape loop (tape buffer) and then I will be able to record any of my souse with max quietly and with no cable switching of any kind. Even the installation of the tape loop is expensive I anticipate economic feasibly from the project and it will allow freeing up an extra pair of those mean PAD cables….

I just wish Pacific had more friendly access to A/D input sensitivity attenuator. It would make my tape loop vs. tape buffer debate much simpler…

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
11-12-2009 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,734
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 64
Post ID: 12246
Reply to: 12009
How little a simple man need!
fiogf49gjkf0d
Last couple days I was playing with my new tape looped Placette, riming Pacific from Tape Rec output. How little a Moron need to be happy!!! Even I still have some technical issuers that I need to resolve using Pacific in and out of the tape loop but it is so comfortable to have Pacific A/D be able to monitor the sound of the whole system. For instance now juts with a flip of a bottom I might have my phonostage output send to all digital analyses tool I have in my DAW. How about the super precise setting of antiscating by phase meter or monitoring the performance of a cartridge by high resolution RTA? It is not that it was not available before but now it is right there with no need to move anything or switch the cables. I can play whatever I play or I might play and let the Pacific to record what I play. The LP/Tapes borrowing might have a new meaning for me now… The recording/replaying quality at 88K and 176K and from none FM source is under evaluation now. Whatever the conclusion will be the level of comport if very appealing.

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
11-12-2009 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
manisandher
London
Posts 157
Joined on 09-05-2008

Post #: 65
Post ID: 12248
Reply to: 12246
Placette and Model Two
fiogf49gjkf0d
Sounds very convenient Romy.

I'm very interested in hearing your thoughts on the quality of the tape loop - did you go for a buffered I/O? I'm even more interested in hearing your thoughts on 88.2KHz vs. 176.4KHz...

Mani.
11-12-2009 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,734
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 66
Post ID: 12251
Reply to: 12248
I could not believe how I lived without the tape loop.
fiogf49gjkf0d
Using the AD/DA and employing those Dominus cables I could not believe lived without the tape loop.  Plugging Pacific into the loop I in fact save one spare cable and got assurance that I would never will move/plug/unplug my AD anymore. I feel like was just born – I discovery some new conveniences that I did not have before and I just LOVE those conveniences.  When there is a zero effort to activate AD off the tape out then the Pacific suddenly might act not only as a recorder but as a high precision external meter for all system.  How about to measure phonostage noise level… in real time? How about to have an objective tool to synchronize the level of any of the 12 system inputs  with with 0.2 dB per segment resolution?  How about to have a visual tool to analyze the compression of the played program?  The most important that it requires no efforts and has no affect to sound – very cool, I wish I was smart enough to set up it this way before… It is some convenient that I moved Pacific atop of my rack to have an easy access to it. 

PasificWithTapeLoop.JPG

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
01-07-2010 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,734
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 67
Post ID: 12635
Reply to: 10628
Mani and his Pacific empathy journey.
fiogf49gjkf0d

Mani, I was pointed to your thread at about Pacific:

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/content/Pacific-Microsonics-Model-Two

I do not want to join the thread and extend credit to the computer audiophile site. The idiot that runs that site is industry ass liking whore – I truly hate that type. I also do not truly know why you need to play those games.  You have the unit, you like what it does or not – why do you care about anybody else recognition of endorsement?  I truly do not understand it.

A few words from my experience. Figuratively speaking 50% of the Pacific’s quality is A/D converter, 35% is rate converter, the rest 15% is DAC.  The D/A section of this processor is juts for control and monitor what is A/D converter does. It is not bad but it is not what Pacific was made for.

Anyhow, I hope you find a lot of compassion from the computer audiophile Morons.

Rgs, Romy the Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
02-06-2010 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,734
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 68
Post ID: 12865
Reply to: 10628
Pacific outside of Master Mode at higher sampling rates.
fiogf49gjkf0d
I was playing some 168K and 192K files recently and I have discovered that the higher sampling rate the more sensitive Sound to Pacific serve in master mode. At 1X Sound slightly better in Master Mode, still tolerable with independent clocks. At 2X the difference is more notable and at 4X to use Pacific outside of Master Mode is vertically imposable as it makes sound too bright and insultingly zippy.

What interests me is to learn if the described characteristic is a property of Pacific or if it is the property of the Lynx card. It would be interesting if Pacific would have an option to slave it to the source’s clock not only vice-versa.

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
02-06-2010 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
manisandher
London
Posts 157
Joined on 09-05-2008

Post #: 69
Post ID: 12871
Reply to: 12865
Masters and Slaves
fiogf49gjkf0d
Romy, you may recall that I observed a similar phenomenon: "What I've noticed in the past is an HF 'halo' around instruments and voices which is absent in Master mode. It's not unpleasant, but I find it distracting. As a result, Master mode certainly sounds more relaxed and fluid. In any event, as I've intimated before, the difference is such that I 'can't' listen in any other mode."

Is this more pronounced with 176.4/192 material? I think it is. Nowadays, I 'upsample' all 16/44.1 material to 176.4, using a form of upsampling called 'Arc Prediction' in XXHighEnd. I much prefer the filtering in the software (which the developer claims has zero pre- and post-ringing) to the 'dated' PMD100 filter in the Model Two. At this rate, using the Model Two in anything other than Master Mode is unlistenable... for exactly the reasons you site.

 Romy the Cat wrote:
It would be interesting if Pacific would have an option to slave it to the source’s clock not only vice-versa.
But you can by switching to REF_CLK!

Mani.
02-17-2010 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
manisandher
London
Posts 157
Joined on 09-05-2008

Post #: 70
Post ID: 12961
Reply to: 12871
Inconsistencies in Model Two clock
fiogf49gjkf0d

The Weiss AFI1 interface is measuring the following clock rates (in KHz) from the Model Two:

- 44.122
- 88.244
- 176.488

AND

- 48.000
- 96.000
- 192.000

Does this imply that the 48x clock is more accurate than the 44.1x clock in the Model Two? I'm assuming that the 44.1x clock is the same as that in the Model One, so perhaps an 'older' and less accurate design than the 48x clock.

How important is a 0.05% inaccuracy in the 44.1x clock rate anyway? Audible? Anything to be worried about, e.g. is this a sign that the clock at the end of its life?

Mani.

02-17-2010 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,734
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 71
Post ID: 12962
Reply to: 12961
How practically important is it?
fiogf49gjkf0d

 manisandher wrote:

The Weiss AFI1 interface is measuring the following clock rates (in KHz) from the Model Two:

- 44.122
- 88.244
- 176.488

AND

- 48.000
- 96.000
- 192.000

Does this imply that the 48x clock is more accurate than the 44.1x clock in the Model Two? I'm assuming that the 44.1x clock is the same as that in the Model One, so perhaps an 'older' and less accurate design than the 48x clock.

How important is a 0.05% inaccuracy in the 44.1x clock rate anyway? Audible? Anything to be worried about, e.g. is this a sign that the clock at the end of its life?

Mani, I do not understand the argument that older clock has less accurate design. What do you mean the “older clock”? The model one has the same 44x and 48x clocks, so there is no older and newer clocks I guess. I presume that in Pacific as in any other processors there are just two base clocks and multipliers. So, one of them is a bit off the calibration. Presumably that it is not a mis-calibration Weiss AFI1 interface the question would be what difference it makes?

If you record and play on the same Pacific then it would make no different of any kind. If you use file from another A/D processors then… how do you know that they were calibrated to the exact sapling rate? I am sure none of them were. So, the question would be: how auditable it is?

If you record at one sapling rate and play at slightly other then you have the absolutely the same effect as tape played at wrong speed. You need 44.100K but you have instead 22Hz away. This will change the tube of your A440 note. Different orchestras, for different music tune the A note to different center frequency, from 420Hz to 475Hz, sometime even more. A few Hertz here and there are auditable but how much the 22Hz of sampling offset (from 44.1K!!!) would relate to a whole note? I did not do circulations but I think it would be in vicinity of 1/131072 (2 power 8) of tone. You might hear 1/64 of note, you might hear 1/128, you might distinct even more but I do not think that you will be able to acknowledge anything more refund. I think anything behind 1/64 of full note is way burden behind the other influences to tine in audio and I do think that might have any practical meaning to look for absolute reference. At least I would not worry about it and would search for other thing to worry.

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
02-17-2010 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
manisandher
London
Posts 157
Joined on 09-05-2008

Post #: 72
Post ID: 12963
Reply to: 12962
22Hz out of 44,100
fiogf49gjkf0d
 Romy the Cat wrote:
The model one has the same 44x and 48x clocks...
Ah, OK. I was of the belief that the Model One could only operate at 44.1 or 88.2. 

 Romy the Cat wrote:
At least I would not worry about it and would search for other thing to worry.
Oh yeah, there are plenty of other things to worry about... provided the clock isn't drifting and accelerating away (if indeed it started out at exactly 44.100Khz in the first place).

 Romy the Cat wrote:
I did not do circulations but I think it would be in vicinity of 1/131072 (2 power 8) of tone.
Yes, it's pretty safe to bet that I wouldn't be able to hear this. Although the other day, my wife walked in wearing a platinum necklace, and I could have sworn that I heard an improvement in the sound. But it doesn't work for anything cheaper than gold.

Mani.

02-17-2010 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,734
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 73
Post ID: 12964
Reply to: 12963
Wearing a platinum necklace and the improvement.
fiogf49gjkf0d

 manisandher wrote:
Ah, OK. I was of the belief that the Model One could only operate at 44.1 or 88.2. 
The only different in clocking is that Model Two has 4 x modes. Model one runs 44, 48, 88, and 96K
 manisandher wrote:
Oh yeah, there are plenty of other things to worry about... provided the clock isn't drifting and accelerating away (if indeed it started out at exactly 44.100Khz in the first place).
A few years back I have a famous industry person visiting me and he played his jazz records. So, accidently put it at 45rpm and it took for him a few trucks to feel that something was wrong. So, your 22Hz out of 44kHz is nothing…
 manisandher wrote:
Yes, it's pretty safe to bet that I wouldn't be able to hear this. Although the other day, my wife walked in wearing a platinum necklace, and I could have sworn that I heard an improvement in the sound. But it doesn't work for anything cheaper than gold.
I think if she was wearing the ONLY necklace of any material and nothing else then it would work for you as well…

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
02-17-2010 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,734
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 74
Post ID: 12965
Reply to: 12963
What difference would it make?
fiogf49gjkf0d
By the way, I just calculated. 22Hz x 440Hz / 44.1kHz = 0.21950137Hz.

It means that offset of your Pacific cloak to 22Hz of sapling rate would lead to  0.22Hz offset of A tone. I truly do not feel that it has any practical influence. Particularly considering that we do not know if the clocks that were recording the files were running the exact 44.10000. Something suggests me that Pacific most likely has much more stringent clock stabilization then other less expensive possessors. Here is the Lynx reads the Pacific in master mode.

PacificClock.JPG




"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
03-01-2010 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,734
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 75
Post ID: 13047
Reply to: 10628
I think Euphonix will help me to move.
fiogf49gjkf0d
I am sure I will not pay to my movers to move my Pacific to a new room. On Saturday, during recording of the MET the Model Two died. It thin it was a good final for this unit in my old home. So, David Peck of Euphonix will be handling it during a next month. I do not think I will be doing a whole a lot of audio in March…..

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
03-01-2010 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
manisandher
London
Posts 157
Joined on 09-05-2008

Post #: 76
Post ID: 13048
Reply to: 13047
Cause of death?
fiogf49gjkf0d

Romy, what actually happened? Do you know what is wrong?

I know that my unit was with Dave 2-3 years - it transpired that its power supply was faulty (a capacitor, I think). In any event, I hope the issue with yours isn't too serious. You probably know that Dave holds all the parts to fix pretty much anything... apart from the main circuit boards I believe.

But at least you're in the US - if I had to ship mine across to Dave, it would cost ~$500 in shipping alone!

Good luck!

Mani.

03-01-2010 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,734
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 77
Post ID: 13052
Reply to: 13048
The autopsy will show….
fiogf49gjkf0d
I have no idea what happened to it. I hope the autopsy will show and I hope David will be able to take care about it. I do anticipate that they will be able to fix whatever it was but I also anticipate that it will be unfortunately very costly.

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
04-29-2010 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,734
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 78
Post ID: 13377
Reply to: 13052
The Pacific is back and the Euphonix sold.
fiogf49gjkf0d
Got the Model 2 from Euphonix a few days back. Expensive but they did a very good job. If even a part of what they said they did was done to my unit then they did not change enough. BTW, Euphonix was sold a few days back to Avid. Will new Avid/Euphonix continue to support Pacifics, and if it will then how long,… is only god knows….

The caT


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
04-29-2010 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
manisandher
London
Posts 157
Joined on 09-05-2008

Post #: 79
Post ID: 13379
Reply to: 13377
Autopsy
fiogf49gjkf0d
Romy, glad to hear it was reparable.

What was wrong with it, and more importantly, what caused it? (Did you have enough ventilation around the PS and the main unit?)

Also, I'm trying to understand why the Model Two draws so much power (200W, right?). Do you know if the PS includes some sort of regenerator?

Mani.
04-29-2010 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,734
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 80
Post ID: 13380
Reply to: 13379
Pacific repair.
fiogf49gjkf0d
The problem with my unit was that in A/D of one channel there was some kind of “very high precision capacitor” the value of which drifted. That offset the A/D and presented the unit to but up. There were a few other minor things that they found and addressed. I have no problem with ventilations.
The power consumption? Why not? Pacific has a lot of under hood and the 200W that it draws sound reasonable to me. I did not see any regeneration in PS, rather the C core transformer, rectification and regular stabilization.

The caT


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
Page 4 of 5 (86 items) Select Pages:  « 1 2 3 4 5 »
   Target    Threads for related reading   Most recent post in related threads   Forum  Replies   Views   Started 
  »  New  Recording options: Pacific Microsonics vs. Lavry Gold...  Pacific Microsonics vs. Lavry Gold in D/A mode....  Didital Things  Forum     24  218682  09-27-2007
  »  New  The BSO and Digital Music...  Around the BSO recording practice....  Didital Things  Forum     44  265308  12-02-2008
  »  New  DA architecture: True Multibit vs. anything else...  If it might…....  Didital Things  Forum     17  144663  12-09-2007
  »  New  The optimum Sampling Rate for bass...  Lynx can handle up to 200.000Khz...  Didital Things  Forum     3  32820  02-19-2008
  »  New  Analog Transfer: the first draft...  What I am after in this test....  Didital Things  Forum     19  126784  04-11-2006
  »  New  Weiss Engineering DAC202..  Attenuation...  Didital Things  Forum     5  40221  06-21-2010
  »  New  Pacific Microsonics Model Two: What Platform, Software ..  XLR to RCA adaptor. Watch out...  Didital Things  Forum     1  21277  03-17-2011
  »  New  Berkeley Audio Design's Alfa Reference DAC...  Well, it fits the pattern....  Didital Things  Forum     4  32077  09-02-2014
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