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11-14-2016 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
noviygera


Chicago, IL
Posts 137
Joined on 06-12-2009

Post #: 1
Post ID: 22838
Reply to: 22838
Midbass injection channel
fiogf49gjkf0d
I want to share what I feel is a good application of an injection channel, as introduced by Romy. But this is different and also useful and i can tell you it works and very well. Of course, I do not recommend to use this application in the same exact way because it's system and room dependent but still I wish I had someone to recommend me this to save time and headaches to end up with this unexpected but very effective approach.

The issue I see before and experience on my own skin is the proper midbass horn integration due to the physical size of a proper horn and the trouble of having to delay for a good continuous phase response that requires physical alignment.

Bottom line: I gave up to have a dedicated midbass horn channel. Instead, for now, imagine no midbass channel. Horns or any system with 3-way: high mid and bass. Usually the bass has no business playing up to the mid. In my case the Aura 1808 does not play well into the mids to properly integrate with my midrange horn. But lets ignore this and let it play to the crossover point of the mid. There will be a dip where the bass driver is losing expression and clarity near the midrange crossover. Now inject your midbass channel at the same frequency range the bass is playing. 

This is where the injection worked for me on different levels. 1. the midbass channel follows the same phase as the bass. No unnecessary phase shifts from adding another channel.2. the midbass injection fills in where the bass loses clarity and tone. It fills that dip3. the midbass naturally rolls off where the bass picks up power and tone.4. there is a continuous transition from horn mids to less and less horny sound, very smoothly transitioning into direct radiator sound.

Midbass_injection.jpg


In the case of Romy's system, I also see this being a good option to try. I think you can still have a midbass horn sound but without the midbass horn.  Romy, you say you have 73hz crossover from your round big horns, correct?

Now play your bass tower channels up to 73hz. Then inject your Vitavox (also 73hz lowpass, just like the bass channels). The Vitavox sealed boxed may roll off where the Bass towers pick up power. Maybe that will be the 50Hz transition you are looking for?

And ultimately, Romy, I wrote this because I think you can consider this one-step-further evolution of the midbass injection together with your current system. Put the Vitavox in the largest possible horn that will fit comfortably in your listening room, along the wall, maybe it will be a flat, rectangular 80hz horn. Crossover your round horns at 100Hz to BOTH the midbass and bass channels. This will be what I consider the midbass injection channel.

Your thoughts on this?
Gera
11-15-2016 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,495
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 2
Post ID: 22844
Reply to: 22838
I do not think so....
fiogf49gjkf0d
Gera, the notion to let drivers to run with phase consistent crossover, preferably 1 order, having big overlaps is not new and I use it aggressively. The problem in what you propose (if I understand you properly) is that you can’t not run your MD driver into a larger horn and cross it too low. A too large horn will not load/EQ the driver. Also, the excessive LF that will be coming with signal will stress the driver diaphragm very badly and you will never get any more or less good MF for that MF drive.


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
11-22-2016 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
noviygera


Chicago, IL
Posts 137
Joined on 06-12-2009

Post #: 3
Post ID: 22862
Reply to: 22844
Agreed
fiogf49gjkf0d
I realized you meant Midbass when you wrote MD. I agree that letting the midbass horn run full range on the bottom is not a good idea. My point was try the bass channel (Aura 1808) run much higher and share the same crossover as the midbass when crossing over to the midrange horn (200hz). Overall, this was a better solution than having a separate freq range for bass and again for midbass. The overlap is a good solution.Example:
bass crossover @ 200hz to midrange
midbass horn crossover @ 120hz and 200hz
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