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08-12-2009 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,540
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 1
Post ID: 11370
Reply to: 11370
Audio and the “Alzheimer’s triggers”
fiogf49gjkf0d

The name of this thread a bit cryptic and need to be explained, as the Alzheimer in my vocabulary means slightly different things then it is commonly recognized.  When I was 13 years old I read a book (I do not remember what it was) that was dedicated to the subject how people at different age perceive reality differently. There was a section in there that described how mind of old people get changed with age, with many examples, including those that described the changes with use of memories. It was illustrated that older people can very sharply recall in own memory long happened and almost forgotten events from on past and to re-live them with very high degree of vividness. This quality was attributed only to old people in that book.

As I progress with my age (I am 42 now) I am detecting that I am getting more stupid - this is a subject of my regular discussions with my friends. Sure, my functions are more experienced and more effective but it does not hide from myself the fact that my mind is not as flexible and is not as engaging as it use to be. One of many changes that I observe is that my memory is changing – I just begin to forget the things.  At the same time I realized that I begin to remember the things that I thought I do not remember and am able to experience them with a new strange colorfulness and realism.

I begun to observe it I would say 5-6 years back and at that time I came up with a comfortable for myself explanation. I decided that all humans from birth have Alzheimer’s, very slow progressive Alzheimer’s. With some people it begin to show up at 50, at 70s, some people die from different cause without letting the Alzheimer’s symptoms to be develop and some people have a fully symptomatic Alzheimer’s at 20 – they just do not know it. Do not criticize my theory - I am badly informed in medical field. However, as the result of my theory is that the word “Alzheimer’s” is how I personally label any changes in memory and cognitive functions of my life. 

What is particularly interested to me is something that I call “the Alzheimer’s triggers”. The Alzheimer’s triggers are another BS term that I invented and it describes the sensations that start the events of “unreasonable memorization”. The triggers might be everything: color or light, specific view, smell, taste, texture, logical pattern, intellectual or spiritual circumstance… anything but it also might be sound.

So, the “my version of Alzheimer’s” and Audio – how does it work? Let pretend that a specific sonic sensation was accountable for my mind being sent to a memory trip. Let pretend that listening a specific sequence of tones I got a sensation of me being 7 years old and experience a feeling that I had during my first day in elementary school. Can Audio, as the Alzheimer’s trigger, as an initiator of those experiences, modify the depth and the vividness of those memories or Audio just can modify the probability of  the triggering the memory trip itself? (Read the last sentence again – it is important)

The second huge question is that sound is the only know to me Alzheimer’s trigger that has subconscious Alzheimer’s aim. It is a bit tricky, try to read from here slowly, I will try to type slowly.  Any other Alzheimer’s triggers that I experienced were understood by me and I have very conscious explanation what and why my memories were referred to. Like smelling of a specific scent or experience some kind of visual deja vo sensation might arouse my stream of overly graphic memories,   but those memories are pointers to the things that I remember and know from my past. The Sonic Alzheimer’s triggers sometimes do the same BUT they also sometimes have pointers to the things I do not know cognitively. I feel that the aimed memories were the part of my experiences in past, I have all evidences of my mind that it relive my own past experiences, I feel my footprints  and my fingermarks all of over the memories, but I not always can identify when and how I got those memories. Furthermore, and here it becomes very interesting,  in some cases I do know that could NOT have some experiences in my past BUT I still re-experience some events is if I was the participant of them and I still have those fingerprints of my own participation.

In my view the major ingredient of the Alzheimer’s trigger in audio are Melody and Absolute Tone (you might want look up at my site my definition of Absolute Tone). The specific harmonic signature of tonal sequences in some cases are able to unlock the ancestry of own experiences from past and to fire up the Alzheimer’s triggers.  Could the purely Audio expressive methods be used in mitigation of the Alzheimer’s triggerabilety?  Could those changes of crossover slopes, plate voltages, diaphragms compression, biasing methods, core types,  grounding patterns , directivity of cables,  VTA of cartridges or type of rectification might be something that is more or less prone to make a playback  to have a higher probability of Alzheimer’s triggering.  Sure, the Alzheimer’s trips are not the purpose or objective of music reproduction. Still, my observations of the phenomena suggest that it is highly possible that a playback with higher rate of Alzheimer’s triggering has also a higher degree of musicality. It not necessary a direct link but I have seen that the wrong audio methods distract the Alzheimer’s triggering and musicality of playback at the same time, so not using the “wrong audio methods”  benefit both musicality AND Alzheimer’s triggering.

Rgs, Romy the Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
08-13-2009 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Axel
South Africa
Posts 80
Joined on 07-18-2009

Post #: 2
Post ID: 11377
Reply to: 11370
'Lost memory' revival triggers
fiogf49gjkf0d
Romy,
you might have read more than 3 words only of my Bartók posting, and what you are now posting is EXACTLY what I was on about when I said:
"Bartók can stir emotional reactions, that can take one back to pictures and related feeling way back into childhood and then to other places during ones life also. If music 'connects' it can evoke such 'lost' feelings and notions, somehow re-connecting them into the present -- they are actually not lost, just temporarily forgotten."

Whether this is Alzheimer triggered by the 'right' sounds I would not know, since as you mentioned, I would have to have had Alzheimer then from 20 or 30 years back ~ ? Maybe not a good thing to think, - having seen an aunt of mine going that way. But yes, the old memory being well in tact and all the 'new' stuff (5 min. old) getting 'de-registered' that's Alzheimer the way I've seen it.

Now the question if it is music only, or mostly, that can provide the trigger.
In my own experience it is NOT. Very seldom as mentioned, I found some 'long lost smell memory' will make -lost memory- re-surface, and more often an 'unusual' colour or better, blend / mix of colours. Example: the twisted sugar candy sticks with vivid colours sort of twirled up in that candy stick. It is usually something that is not seen or heard anymore after the memory has been buried, and the unusual re-occurrence of the colour(s), smell, or tone event will re-surface the memory.
The question remains: why would the dissonant sound sequence of a Bartók Violin Sonata take you into a place along a some city street walking, age 5, from Kindergarten back home?
It is the MOOD I guess that is re-reflected that you held in your emotions that is evoked by the music, maybe  a little lost, lonesome, ponderous, floating some where undefined. Maybe not too unusual for a child to feel, but this sort of detached 'floating' (Verinnerlichung... =~ Internalization) just 'being in the moment' is later in live not really much happening anymore, and I guess due to increased worries by demands of all sorts put on one .

Something like that I suspect can be the case. The good thing is, that these type of re-awakened memory-snippets are usually pleasant - even if of some sweet sadness, feeling of some vague loss, or such.

Axel

08-13-2009 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,540
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 3
Post ID: 11378
Reply to: 11370
Alzheimer Triggers vs. Deep Listening Cycles
fiogf49gjkf0d
I received a commentary via private emails from a visitor on the site to a section of witch I would like to respond publically as I feel that my reply might slightly elaborates what I was talking about.
 
I would differentiate the “deep listening cycles” and the “Alzheimer Triggers”. The Alzheimer Triggers are more like the unconditional reflexes.  The deep listening cycles I think are subjects of musicality and artistry vs. the Alzheimer Triggers are more the subject of mechanical reaction to sonic irritations. I have detested that some cased the Alzheimer Triggers were sound but were not part of music at all, like the scratching sound of frying pan with a knife of specific material and shape. You would hardly call it music and no one has any deep listening cycles about it. Still, in some cases the knife and the pan might prose some harmonics (it actually happened a few weeks back) which suddenly open a communication bridge with my past memorizes.  
 
When I observed the Alzheimer Triggers, at lease how it works for me, I was not able to stratify past or future listening experiences at the SLLB levels (Static perception, Dynamic perception, Emotional perception, Esthetic perception, Ethical perception, Re-Creative perception, Not Named Level) primary because there was not further listening. The Alzheimer Triggers is an instantaneous event that has no continuation is time. That is why I call it trigger.
 
The “deep listening cycles” is not even but rather a ceremony, a time-encompassing process that is similar to meditative ceremonies.  Also, those “deep listening cycles might” have short- of long-lasting transfigurative function vs. the Alzheimer Triggers have, at least in my experience, absolutely zero consequences.
 
The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
08-13-2009 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Axel
South Africa
Posts 80
Joined on 07-18-2009

Post #: 4
Post ID: 11379
Reply to: 11378
Yet one more 'trigger' not mentioned...
fiogf49gjkf0d
is that of any physical, bodily touch-sensation(s). I think the 'of no consequence' explanation is very well put.
If it happens, it is COMPLETLY beyond ANY intention, rational, or logical consequence of what is going on RATIONALLY.

The additional trigger of 'touch' would do EXACTLY the same, but as it is with music it would need at least need some degree of 'non-defendedness' I.E. receptiveness by some relaxation. An example is, that during a foot- or calf-massage some more 'recent' ~ 10 year old COMPLETELY 'irrelevant' memory of walking down a street in Turku / Finland (just THAT ~ irrelevant moment) gets triggered (THIS IS HAPPENING YEARS LATER ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE WORLD) - BUT it is connected to a feeling of sorts which again seems irrelevant, as it simply just "IS" in some moment of time. All completely outside the so called rational domain.
Axel
PS: I think the majority of 'western conditioned' minds do not really want to go there, since anything beyond the immediate rational would actually be perceived as unhealthy, scary, stupid, idiotic, or plain irresponsible, etc.
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  »  New  A playback and wrong notes...  Why is it not common practice?...  Playback Listening  Forum     5  38227  03-12-2007
  »  New  About the Playbacks’ Thinkability...  The right stuff...  Playback Listening  Forum     5  28126  01-30-2009
  »  New  How to build the best audio payback..  How a best payback should sound?...  Playback Listening  Forum     1  17745  04-15-2006
  »  New  The Patrick Flanagan’s Neurophone..  There is no seventh channel for now....  Playback Listening  Forum     4  19521  11-24-2008
  »  New  The “sounds” that I am looking for...  Attitudes and results...  Playback Listening  Forum     5  28546  05-19-2008
  »  New  The “Implied Sound” in Audio...  The recording ART?...  Playback Listening  Forum     24  99278  07-24-2008
  »  New  Remembering Sound…..  "....and realises that he did not even know how to...  Playback Listening  Forum     3  22029  11-15-2006
  »  New  Adding one more spherical to Macondo...  It is about magnet and SS type....  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     92  700976  05-23-2006
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