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In the Forum: Playback Listening
In the Thread: “How audio might sound”
Post Subject: Su-su-surrealistic audio?Posted by Romy the Cat on: 3/13/2005

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 Antonio J. wrote:
But having some ideas of the sonic attributes that accomplish that "feeling" would be very helpful. So you couldn't help that someone listening to such a system wanted to build a clone of it.

I do not think it is possible, even conceptually. Sure there are many people out there who would suggest that audio-success” and audio help come form the specific precompiled, encapsulated, binary solution – would it be amplifier, speaker of any other wrapable and UPS deliverable subjects. I very much disagree with this vision. Pretend that I have a wonderfully performing item of audio and you learned about it and decided to replicate it (buy it). I have seen many and many times within countless installations when being plugged into differed user consciousness the item might not perform well. Certainly there are no problems with equipment compliance (this all could be easily taken care at kindergarten audio level). Why would it be so?

You see, there are such things as listen Sound, hear Sound and understood Sound. The performance of specific devises sometimes require a certain state of a listener readiness, sort of synergy between the component ability and the listener capacity to embrace those abilities. Pay attention that I brought very-very simplified example but in real life the satiations way more complex and in many instances it take years for a person to figure the things out, many never do. Thus you would see very frequently a situation, when an average audiophile exposed to a new for him/her playback that was not bult according to the primitive concepts of sounds reproduction and that transitionally evolved. In that satiation the audiophile juts do not understand what is going on with system and with him/her. However, and this is the ketch, when the playback is at a state of completion and was evaluated and “certified” as “reedy to go” then actually no preparation, even internal, is require. So, the cloning in audio, and particularly while audio in a transitional stage is as useful as performing lobotomy…
 Antonio J. wrote:
Undoubtedly you're right, this would be just an exposition to "what can be done" and it would work for people with the same kind of background, interests and goals of the person setting up the SPD. If that system is setup for the best possible reproduction of recorded symphonic music and the eventual listener also wants to listen to huge choral works, perhaps it wouldn't work as good for him. This person should get his system to optimize his experience with the kind of music he wants to listen to.

Not really, at a final version all chickens come rust and all rules, laws, prejudges and misbelieves come to the very much same common denominator.  Interesting that this common denominator is absolutely do not violate and do not conflict with preferences, inclinations and subjectivism of each individual…. This is kind of a separate and very big topic and I would not dive into it at this point.

 Antonio J. wrote:
The problem as I see it is that building these kind of "Ultrasystems" requires an inner growth and acquiring some skills and knowledge that in these times we're living people is not ready to spend on them.

Absolutely, and people who when far enough in their growth understand that those systems are not really necessary.
 Antonio J. wrote:
All they want is "plug and play", they want the results and don't want the hard work behind the results, which are so personal and self conditioned that aren't transferrable from one person to another. There are some very basic principles which can be tought, but little else. It's something comparable to learning to play a musical instrument, you can learn the fingers postions and movements, you can learn to read music, but nobody will ever teach you to feel what you're playing and how to transfer your own emotions, intentions and essence into what you're playing, unless you go into formulaic tricks.

Well, I do not know any “basic principles” that work. There are a lot of completely dead pianists with very properly positioned fingers and there are many audio people who can read lectures and write books about audio but who familiar only with extremity crapy audio results. You did suggested that no one would teach you to feel what you're playing. Why do you think that a process of shaping of sound in your listening room is less imaginative then any other creative activity? I personally visualize a person who makes sound in a listing room as a contactor of orchestra who is responsible for the results, of course using very different expressive tools.

 Antonio J. wrote:
Being exposed to a SPD would be interesting, but as you see it and I understand it should be, it might produce more distress and frustration than being as blind as most of us are now. It would be as frustrating as exposing a person eating survival pre-cooked food all his life to a delicious meal with belluga, the finest sirloin, cakes and wines you can find on Earth, cooked by the best cook, and after that leaving him back again to his survival food. Just a nice experience, but nothing that really can help you to get a better life each forthcoming day. You should be tought to cook, to get the condiments and to find the markets to get the food to be cooked. With that knowledge you'd be able to cook for yourself things closer to that delicious meal, or even better if you can do it completely adapted to your own taste, but without the basics, you can do very little. How could one learn the basics of "true music through audio"?

I do not think that it would produce “distress and frustration”. The distress and frustration are produced when a person pays $40K for TT, $95K for a loudspeaker, $10K for a cartridge, 120K for cables and $50K for amplifier, spending years to pursue all this BS and in the end up, s/he end up with bad sound and with compile luck of understanding why it happened. The exposure to SPD would set a feeling of what is possible and would embed into audiophile awareness a reference points: what might be done.

You see, when we talk with audio people they manipulate definitions the have no values. They, for instance, all talk about bass but none of them (or very few) even heard a properly reproduced bass. If you let to a person once to hear “live” sounding bass by means of sound reproduction then it is really revolutionary experience. I have seen people who after being exposed to proper bass completely and very radically changed this tastes about music. How much dose IT worth? It’s not juts about bass - I simplified it.  Music, if it properly perceived has a huge educational and personality-shaping effect. An ability to invoke voluntary those “personality-shaping moments” at a level when a personality could actually be affected is a very freaky feeling. Do not forget that a lucky person could within his lifetime catch very few great and really impactfull, personality-shaping performances. With SPD, when you can flip those performances by an allegorical “punch of button” you reach a totally different level of “event management”… The habitual audiophile people are accustomed to fight with thier audio or in many instances juts suffer form it. But it could be very different. The purpose of SPD might be to demonstrate that another approach of relationship with own audio is very possible…

Rgs,
Romy the Cat

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