GoodSoundClub - Romy the Cat's Audio Site

In the Forum: Audio Discussions
In the Thread: The Classical Music Café syndrome...

Post Subject: Sound of one lip flapping...Posted by Joe Roberts on: 5/27/2009

Well, I was there, which is more than The Cat can say. In fact, The Cat never heard a complete WE system first hand, so I'll have to take that into advisement when the expected foaming-at-the-whiskers rant.

I always wonder why people would give credence to either critiques or WE worship on this topic from somebody who never actually heard a big "properly implemented" WECO system. Either way is it projection of dreams onto reality. Speakers are, after all, experience machines and this is the proper way to frame the discussion of merits and failings. It is nice to fantasize and we all do it, but actual physical loudspeakers are pure reality.

I understand that not all WE gear is great but some most definitely is. Some of the WE multicell horns are a bit too forward for my taste, but certain units such as the 12A and 15A are superb. Some of the parts can be good in mix and match, but using the good WE horns with matching equipment in original configuration is another story entirely from trying one or two WE drivers with Altec horns or similar experiments.

Also, I can side with critique of people who think anything that says "Western Electric" is better than anything that doesn't, but that stupidity is not the point here. It helps when selling Western Electric resistors on ebay though. I got $50 for a pair of 600 ohm non-inductive wirewounds last year and bought myself a nice pair of sneakers.

A critical point is that the systems on my vacation photos page are complete WECO systems with all the matching crossovers and whatnot. These are not kludged together, half-hearted attempts. This is the real deal, factory configuration. As you said above "properly implemented"--including rooms big enough to let the system perform properly.

Two of the three systems I pictured on my link were really, really outstanding. The pictured "Mr. K's upstairs system" with 12As was quite possibly the best I have ever heard in my life. The 15A system at Camerata was nothing to sneeze at either.

As you can see from the pics, they have a lot of extra stuff that they tried in order to identify what the "good stuff" is. It was very educational for me to A-B different horns in the same system. Got to say that the big wood horns with 555s strike my ear as the best of the lot.

I suppose by that "type" of people you mean super-rich Asians who could buy Romy the Cat with loose pocket money to feed to their dog.

Just because a guy is a billionaire who uses a Neumann cutting lathe as a turntable and has more gear than any ten people deserve, doesn't mean he's off the true path. Sadly, it may be true that money sometimes CAN buy knowledge, or at least it helps a lot.

I doubt that you actually know anybody like these Korean guys. Don't make the mistake of thinking that these folks are dilettantes...they have been in audio for decades, have tried it all, and they know what they are doing. These Korean maniacs are very smart, ultra-successful men who are as serious and driven about audio as anybody you will ever encounter. They all have 20,000 LPs and love music too.

Why, if they have literal warehouses of vintage and modern gear, American, German, Japanese, do they choose to foreground WE theater systems in their listening rooms and audio consciousness?

Their knowledge and focus is not theoretical but based on experience. The results are impressive.

Nobody is more sober and jaded on audio than me and I was stunned by those 12As with 4181s. They played large orchestral and Stevie Ray Vaughan, Joni Mitchell, whatever...everything I heard on that system was really an intense experience. The bass from a single TA-4181 per side in those WE baffles was insane, with no hangover or smearing, and the power of a locomotive when the signal called it up. The sense of scale and vividness was nothing like my meager attempts and I have never heard anything close.

You can believe it or not, but you won't know until you've heard something like this. Some myths are true.

I can state, based on experience, that the big WE systems are on a level far above what most of us have ever heard. You can't get there with TAD, Altec, JBL, etc.

My suspicion is that the field coil woofers in baffles are one special factor and big wood horns are another. I like to think that it would be possible to get in the same ballpark with giant in-wall horns with TADs or something (non-WE) like that. We have all seen pics of home constructed off-the-chain horn systems. I haven't heard them but have I heard the Western theater gear and, thus far, WE "Wide Range"-era takes the prize for me.

The kind of speculation, wankery, and sophistry found on audio forums has its place, but let's not confuse that with direct experience and knowledge.

This is one of the very few audio forums I ever post on, because I like the air of insane passion about a tiny slice of audio reality, but whenever I do post, I have to be in the mood to make the same old arguments about experience vs. more or less informed speculation.

I simply stopped in to identify the pictured system, and say that if anyone winds up in Seoul, try to make the trip to Heyri Art Village to hear the Camerata system. I like the fact that Mr. Hwang is sharing it with the music loving visitors to the coffeeshop, few of whom know about vintage audio. Most of these WE theater systems are in in mega-rich guys private listening rooms and impossible to access without social connections....this is a bit of a waste.

And, hey Romy, you were invited on this trip but you punked out!! Or, shall I say, you "missed out!!"

Best to all,

Joe Roberts

PS: The food was excellent also. Too bad you couldn't join us for barbecued clam at Incheon harbor.

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