| Search | Login/Register
   Home » Melquiades Amplifier » More power from Melquiades? More powerful tube? (9 posts, 1 page)
  Print Thread | Thread Start |   
Page 1 of 1 (9 items) Select Pages: 
   Target    Threads for related reading   Most recent post in related threads   Forum  Replies   Views   Started 
  »  New  6C41C – the journey to nowhere...  6C41C the verdict...  Melquiades Amplifier  Forum     1  5827  08-24-2005
  »  New  How to get a LOT of SET power...  Cost and justification of existence...  Audio Discussions  Forum     6  6105  02-26-2006
  »  New  The Melquiades bass channels: the coupling capacitor...  bias continued...  Melquiades Amplifier  Forum     11  9309  08-13-2007
  »  New  Output transformer for bass-channel of Super Melquiades..  The Super Milq bass channel loading correction...  Melquiades Amplifier  Forum     2  3860  08-17-2007
  »  New  NAT Audio Magna -160 Watts of Single-Ended Class A..  The KR Audio ways....  Audio Discussions  Forum     5  7088  11-12-2007
  »  New  The 60-inch LF driver...  And here is a good tube for a powerful SET :-)...  Audio Discussions  Forum     1  2081  03-17-2008
  »  New  The loudspeakers for a powerful SET..  Current "Thinking"...  Audio Discussions  Forum     26  18307  04-11-2008
  »  New  Small SET’s bass, besides everything- is it about power..  Weak SET bass...  Audio Discussions  Forum     3  3240  01-12-2009
09-01-2007 Post mapped to one branch of Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 5,637
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 1
Post ID: 5200
Reply to: 5200
New Site Posts
Get in the people tha
Bye bye all
Tips (bribes)
To move audio equipme
The PP2000 version 20
In spite of it all...
The new PP2000 not as
Random Subjects
The benefits of ultra
Electronluv systems q
About beauty and ugli
The best “Die Flederm
CD horn and JBL: Cros
Ca(r)t before the hor
FM Acoustics
More power from Melquiades? More powerful tube?

What would I do if I move to a much larger room and the power of Milq’s full 6C33C would not be enough? Surely it would be possible to go for transmission tubes but they all high plate impedance and high voltage.
If I parallel all my bass drivers and have around 1R load impedance then it will be a transformer with zillion turns… Also, I am not a big fun of the transmission tubes’ bass.

Adding more drivers in bass array look promising but not necessarily effective or practical. So, it would be interesting to find a high current tube that might be sitting in Milq’s bass channel socket. Since I so like the sound of 6C33C it would be worth to mention that the 6C33C has a bigger brother: 12C42C

The 12C42C was a next tube in the succession or 6C19C, 6C41C, 6C18C/6C33C. The 6C41C had one plate the 6C18C/6C33C were two plated and the 12C42C was simialr tube to the 6C33C but with 3 plates!!! It is not enough to be become purring – look at the 6C33C data:

Filaments: 12.6 and 5A
Anode voltage: 120V
Anode Current: 1A
Plate impedance: 65R
Maximum Anode dissipation -120W




"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
11-16-2007 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
morricab
Posts 51
Joined on 07-13-2005

Post #: 2
Post ID: 5877
Reply to: 5200
Maybe a good single ended OTL amps?
Hi Romy,
Have you ever thought of trying to build or have built for you a SE OTL?  You know that there is one on the market from the company transcendent sound using multiple 6C19PI output triodes? 

Perhaps a few of these 12C42C tubes would make for a great SE OTL of about a few watts, which should be enough and perhaps it doesn't get any purer sounding.
11-16-2007 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 5,637
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 3
Post ID: 5878
Reply to: 5877
An amp with 64 x 6C19P tubes?
Nope, I am not a big friend of OTL amps generally… BTW, I have seen (did not heard) one Japanese amp that use 64 x 6C19P tubes. For whatever reasons Russians consider that 6C19P as very good sounding tube - the younger sister of 6C33C. It was not my experience and I actually did not like how this tube (in classic SET application) sounded when I tried it. Perhaps in OTL application it might do different – I do not know. I bought a few year years 400 of them for $70, sometimes I would need to use them up…


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
04-04-2008 Post mapped to one branch of Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 5,637
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 4
Post ID: 7118
Reply to: 5200
New Site Posts
Get in the people tha
Bye bye all
Tips (bribes)
To move audio equipme
The PP2000 version 20
In spite of it all...
The new PP2000 not as
Random Subjects
Why I do not love Mah
VTL TL-7.5 Reference:
Gas voltage reference
The Expressive Techno
Zigmahornets Speakers
Brahms Double Concert
SS Amplification for
And here is a good tube for a powerful SET :-)

Whonna to drive dead woofers with single ended triode? Get the Bell Laboratories 320A tube.

The 320A Vacuum tube was designed for use as an oscillator, modulator, or amplifier at the higher power levels
and high frequencies.

Filament ratings: 35 volts at 435 amperes
Average thermionic emission: 90 amperes
Characteristics at 18 kV plate voltage and 8 amperes plate current:
Amplification factor: 30
Plate resistance: 965 ohms
Transconductance: 31,100 micromhos

Maximum plate voltages: 12.5 kV modulated, 18 kV non modulated, 20 kV RMS AC
current: 15 amps DC
dissipation: 150 kilowatts

Maximum grid dissipation: 2 kilowatt

If somebody build anything around it… please let me know – it would be worth to fly over… :-)


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
05-30-2009 Post mapped to one branch of Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 5,637
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 5
Post ID: 10650
Reply to: 5200
New Site Posts
Get in the people tha
Bye bye all
Tips (bribes)
To move audio equipme
The PP2000 version 20
In spite of it all...
The new PP2000 not as
Random Subjects
About the life-expect
JBL LE8
Bliss
The sound of Concert
The cut or not to cut
A tribune to Transien
Jonathan Valin shell
Another high power triode option.
There was a cool Russian-made tube GU-48. It is high-gain, high power pure direct heated triode with 300W on plate and 10A on carbonized tungsten cathode.  I did not hear but it looks like something in the class of RCA 833 tubes. I think Japanese sell the 833 amps for 200-300 thousand dollars. The GU-48 is around $50-$60 and I do not think that it would be worse; in fact I think it might be even better…

http://www.goodsoundclub.com/pdf/GU48.pdf

GU48_1.jpg

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
05-30-2009 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
drdna
San Francisco, California
Posts 411
Joined on 10-29-2005

Post #: 6
Post ID: 10651
Reply to: 10650
New Russian Tube!
 Romy the Cat wrote:
There was a cool Russian-made tube GU-48...  I do not think that it would be worse; in fact I think it might be even better…

Wait, Romy, you think a RUSSIAN product might be better?  That is a surprise!Smile
Seriously though it looks interesting.  If you have a circuit to suit it, maybe I will build it.
Adrian
05-30-2009 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 5,637
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 7
Post ID: 10652
Reply to: 10651
New Site Posts
Get in the people tha
Bye bye all
Tips (bribes)
Random Subjects
Order your own music…
I would like to belie
Instrumental music vs
The better Russian tubes and 120W SET - might be fan.

Nope, the Russian tubes generally much, in fact much worse than western equivalents. There were however some exceptions. Those options were due to various reasons. The tubes like GM70, YO186, 1P24B, 6E5P, 6N30P, BO188, GM57, UB180, 6C33C, 6N6P, M457, ТО-143, YO104 were very-very good. The GU81, GU48, GU29 were generator tubes and they are presumably OK; I did not hear any good-made amps with it.  The GM70 is transmitting tube as well and it is exceptionably good tube also, way more superior then 211/845 tubes but it is kind of not used yet tube as no one so far made any decently sounding amp with it, at least among those that I heard. So, the Russian transmitting tubes from the GU line might be fine tubes. To make an amp with them is a totally different subject…

What surprises me however is why you have expressed an interest in the high power tubes? You are with horns and even you LF sections have over 100dB sensitivity. What will you do with 120W SET?

Anyhow, I do not have a circuit for this type of amp. The circuit is not a problem, to know how to get sound out of those tubes is the problem and I have no knowledge about it. In the world of transmitting tubes the tube never was a problem. The right output transformer is the problem. It might be VERY expensive to make it properly and it might be very unnecessary due to the existence of DSET concept. Still, to hear a 120W SET over a few days might be a fan experience …

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
05-30-2009 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
drdna
San Francisco, California
Posts 411
Joined on 10-29-2005

Post #: 8
Post ID: 10657
Reply to: 10652
Why a high powered SET?
 Romy the Cat wrote:
What surprises me however is why you have expressed an interest in the high power tubes? You are with horns and even you LF sections have over 100dB sensitivity. What will you do with 120W SET?
The subwoofer still needs a substantial power source. Right now it is being driven by a solid state amplifier.  It would be interesting to see what impact the SET could have here if any.
Adrian
05-30-2009 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 5,637
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 9
Post ID: 10658
Reply to: 10657
Random Subjects
Idea of a 3way horn s
What a trip 30 years
Records Box Stuffing
A single-stage 120W DSET?

 drdna wrote:
 The subwoofer still needs a substantial power source. Right now it is being driven by a solid state amplifier.  It would be interesting to see what impact the SET could have here if any.

I see, I did not know that subwoofer needs a substantial power source. If so then sure it might be interesting. To make from GU-48 a powerful LF DSET would not be difficult.  The output transformer will be very simple as well. The high voltage transformer for transmission tubes usually screen up HF as they need excessive high voltage isolation but for LF only DSET it would be no brainer. Make 500mA transformer with larger lamination you will be able to found and coils with 3000V-4000V isolation. I think if you find somebody why would  make it large enough to get 5Hz-7Hz at FULL POWER then it will be around 500-700 transformer. Everything else will be relatively easy if you can talk like this about an amp hat will have 1.5kV on plate. BTW, the GU-48 has high gain, so who know it might be even a single stage amp…

The Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
Page 1 of 1 (9 items) Select Pages: 
   Target    Threads for related reading   Most recent post in related threads   Forum  Replies   Views   Started 
  »  New  6C41C – the journey to nowhere...  6C41C the verdict...  Melquiades Amplifier  Forum     1  5827  08-24-2005
  »  New  How to get a LOT of SET power...  Cost and justification of existence...  Audio Discussions  Forum     6  6105  02-26-2006
  »  New  The Melquiades bass channels: the coupling capacitor...  bias continued...  Melquiades Amplifier  Forum     11  9309  08-13-2007
  »  New  Output transformer for bass-channel of Super Melquiades..  The Super Milq bass channel loading correction...  Melquiades Amplifier  Forum     2  3860  08-17-2007
  »  New  NAT Audio Magna -160 Watts of Single-Ended Class A..  The KR Audio ways....  Audio Discussions  Forum     5  7088  11-12-2007
  »  New  The 60-inch LF driver...  And here is a good tube for a powerful SET :-)...  Audio Discussions  Forum     1  2081  03-17-2008
  »  New  The loudspeakers for a powerful SET..  Current "Thinking"...  Audio Discussions  Forum     26  18307  04-11-2008
  »  New  Small SET’s bass, besides everything- is it about power..  Weak SET bass...  Audio Discussions  Forum     3  3240  01-12-2009
Home Page  |  Last 24Hours  | Search  |  SiteMap  | Questions or Problems | Copyright Note
The content of all messages within the Forums Copyright © by authors of the posts